38-Athena Estelle-Vaginal Birth-Cecilia-Delivered: Finding Victory After Postpartum Depression Podcast

Description:

In this episode, Athena shares her journey of pregnancy, labor, and birth. She also shares her struggles of getting the much-needed support for her postpartum depression and anxiety, and how it inspired her to create a blog and podcast for others to have a resource when they are going through postpartum mood and anxiety disorders. 

Disclaimer: This podcast is intended for educational purposes only with no intention of giving or replacing any medical advice. I, Kiona Nessenbaum, am not a licensed medical professional. All advice that is given on the podcast is from the personal experience of the storytellers. All medical or health-related questions should be directed to your licensed provider. 

Resources:

• Delivered: finding victory after postpartum depression-Athena Estelle
• Psychology Today: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us 
• Perinatal Support of Washington: https://perinatalsupport.org/ 
• Postpartum Support International: https://www.postpartum.net

Definitions:

• Flat Head Syndrome
• Torticollis 
• Bipolar Mood Disorder/Mania
• EMDR Trauma Therapy 

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Transcription of Episode 38:

[00:00:00] Kiona: Hello, and welcome to Birth As We Know It. I am your podcast host, Kiona Nessenbaum. I have experienced birth as a doula, a student midwife, and as a mother of three amazing children with my husband and high school sweetheart by my side. After attending over 130 births, including my own, I’ve realized that each birth experience is truly unique.

So make sure you subscribe and join me every week as we are guided through many different birth experiences through the lens of the storyteller. Please be aware that some of the stories can be triggering to hear, so feel free to pause, take a breath, and come back and listen whenever you’re ready. With that said, let’s prep ourselves to dive deep and get detailed about what really happens in the birth space.

As a reminder, this podcast is intended for educational purposes only, and has no intention of giving or replacing any medical advice. All advice that is given on the podcast is from the personal experiences of the storytellers. All medical or health related questions should be directed to your licensed provider. 

Before we dive into this episode, I want to share another podcast review with you. This review was written by MW2014NG. It is titled “So beautiful” with a rating of five stars. It says. ” Amazing interviews and beautiful stories. I can’t wait for more episodes.” Thank you so much for leaving this review MW2014NG. It means a lot to hear from those that are listening, what they feel about the podcast. I truly believe that leaving reviews is one of the only ways that we can be connected as a community on this virtual platform. So if you’re listening now, please leave a review. I would love to hear how this podcast is impacting you. And follow the podcast on Instagram, @birthasweknowitpodcast. All right. Let’s dive into the episode.

Hello, everybody, and welcome back to the Birth As We Know It podcast. I am super excited and have a ton of positive energy coming from Athena Estelle today. Athena is a full time physical therapist and she works in inpatient rehab.

And we are going to be talking about the birth of her three year old daughter, Cecilia, who was born at the height of COVID. So there’s going to be some details of COVID in there and how that impacted her pregnancy and birth. And Athena is also the host and writer slash author of her blog slash podcast called Delivered Finding Victory After Postpartum Depression.

And we will get more into how and why she created that. So welcome Athena.

[00:02:52] Athena: Hey, Kiona. Thank you so much for having me. I’m so excited.

[00:02:56] Kiona: Yes, I am super excited to be here with you today, and I’m super excited to hear more about your story, especially since you have an emphasis on postpartum and what that looked like for you. But of course, before we dive too deep into that, let’s go ahead and have you tell us a little bit about yourself and who’s in your family.

[00:03:14] Athena: Okay. so I met my husband in, PT school. We met in the same graduate class and then we were married, a year later in 2014. We had, well, I had our daughter in June of 2020 and her name is Cecilia and she is now a little bit over three.

[00:03:35] Kiona: I love that so much. And like I told you pre recording, Cecilia is just such a classic name, and I love it so much. I love it.

[00:03:42] Athena: Thank you!.

[00:03:43] Kiona: Yes. So, before we dive into your actual pregnancy, labor, and birth, tell us a little bit about your conception journey.

[00:03:52] Athena: Okay,that’s something I try not to, make that a hard topic, but I know a lot of our personal friends and family members have struggled with fertility and, have had their own issues of infertility, so we were super fortunate, and I say that with, like, The most amount of weight as possible because it’s not something that I take for granted, but, we were preventing for about five years and then the month that we decided to, discontinue preventing, we got pregnant pretty quick.

So very, very fortunate and blessed that it was, happened very quick and, Yeah, it was, it was a huge blessing looking back.

[00:04:34] Kiona: Yeah, yeah. I think that’s great. And I, I believe that everybody has their journey and some journeys just take a little bit longer. And I just want to validate that. I think it’s amazing that your journey was quick and she came when you guys were ready for her. So yeah, 

[00:04:49] Athena: Thank you. 

[00:04:50] Kiona: Yeah. of course. So, prior to you becoming pregnant, did you happen to attend any births or anything like that throughout your lifetime, but from, like, siblings, friends, or anything?

[00:05:01] Athena: Yeah. So back in, 2010, I did get to attend my sister Dana’s, birth of her first child, her name is Adriana. and that was hands down, like if we’re talking, marriage is number one and the birth of my daughter’s number two, or vice versa, depending on the day. I would say attending my sister’s birth is like a solid three.

It was so. Just, I mean, you have kids, but it’s just insane to watch someone else go through it. and just like the way that she like handled things and handled her emotions and, yeah, it was, it was very, very cool.

[00:05:40] Kiona: I think that’s so awesome, and I always think it’s great when people have the opportunity to physically see and visualize birth prior to having babies themselves because, I don’t know, it kind of just opens that door of curiosity of what your birth will look like. 

[00:05:54] Athena: Yeah.

[00:05:56] Kiona: So when you did find out that you were pregnant with Cecilia, how were your and your husband’s reactions?

[00:06:02] Athena: Honestly, like shocked, we were actually on a trip for our anniversary in September of 2019 and, in August is when we kind of decided, cause August 10th is our anniversary. So we decided, that was a good time. It was our five year mark. and we were kind of just ready I would say like emotionally and mentally, cause where we live, we have no immediate family.

So we knew that, 100 percent of her care and our day to day routine was on us. So we just wanted to be in a really good place, which we thought we were. And, to this day, I would say we were, and then, we were on a trip in September and I came home and I was thinking, I should have got my period on that trip.

Like I never, I never got my period. Like that was weird. So I let another week and a half go by and I was like, okay, this is getting weird. And then, you know, when you’re stressed and you like can’t get your period, I don’t know if that’s a thing, but it’s like, yeah. So then I, I still didn’t get my period.

And then, October 1st, I took my first pregnancy test and, I had bought one, like, six months before because I thought maybe I was, pregnant. But my periods are always very irregular. Like, I’m talking a four week length, and then maybe six weeks is the next one, and then three weeks, and then five weeks.

It’s just a toss up. So, I didn’t really know. So, anyways, I took the tests. It was positive. And I was like, what? Like how so I ran to the store that night before he got home from work. I grabbed two more all positive I was like, oh damn. Okay, here we go

[00:07:36] Kiona: Yeah,

[00:07:37] Athena: So yeah, it was it was a big shock But I think because we’d kind of prepared for so long like mentally I think that we were like super excited just Shocked it happened so fast.

[00:07:47] Kiona: yeah, yeah, I can only imagine. how did your husband react when you told him? Was he there during the first test or?

[00:07:54] Athena: No, no, he was still at work so we still had like some things out from the trip, just like souvenirs and stuff that we hadn’t shipped home yet. So I had like a pile of stuff in our bedroom, just off to the side that we had to ship home for our family. And, right next to it on the counter in the bathroom, I just had the three tests laying there.

And so when he got home from work, I said, Hey, I found something else that we need to ship back home. go check the sink in the bathroom. And he was like, Oh, okay. So I videotaped it, but I then deleted it afterwards cause I felt bad. But, He comes upstairs and I hear him call down the stairs and he’s like, are you serious?

And I was like, yeah, I’m so excited. Aren’t you excited? And I hear him like sit down at the top of the stairs and he’s like, Whoa. And I said, that’s, I said, that’s, that’s a good whoa, right? And he’s like, yeah, yeah. It’s really good. It’s just, wow. And I said, I know, buddy, I’m right there with you.

[00:08:47] Kiona: Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Oh part of me wishes you didn’t delete that video just for memory’s sake But I also understand, , my husband’s first reaction when we told him, even with our second and our third, he was, like, crying, , he cried with every one, because he’s, like, I’m not ready for this one, I’m not ready for another one, you know, , even though we have those conversations of preparation and, like, everything, when it actually happens is when you kind of get that reality that smacks you in the face that’s, like, oh, okay, this is happening.

[00:09:22] Athena: yes.

[00:09:24] Kiona: Yes. Yes, I get that 100%. oh yeah, so go ahead and tell me a little bit of how your pregnancy actually was. Like. Were you having any struggles with heavy symptoms in the first trimester? Did you have any like medical or health diagnoses throughout your pregnancy?

[00:09:41] Athena: Okay. So, this is also kind of like the ironic thing is that, I like hate ending this too, but my pregnancy was pretty textbook like I did not have any morning sickness. I was actually able to continue working like my whole pregnancy. I was at a different, setting. I was at a skilled nursing unit, and I was able to work the whole time, but it just, so covid hit that January, that’s when they announced it January 2020, they started talking about this mega virus. that was before they were calling it the coronavirus. So, working at a hospital they started having us wear masks. So that became, the daily norm.

You would have to get your temperature checked every morning on your way into the building. I can’t remember what it was. I want to say if it was over 100. I think that if it was higher, you would get sent home, they wouldn’t even let you in the building. They would call your supervisor. You’re not coming in.

You have to go home for the day. so that was really, honestly, the most challenging part about being pregnant. the worst part for me was we didn’t have a COVID unit. So it might’ve been that, room one was like a basic patient with like a knee replacement, but then room two had COVID. And then room three was a heart surgery and then room four was covid.

so that was super anxiety provoking because I would be fine my whole day because none of my patients would have covid, you know When you’re pregnant my workplace was fantastic to me with anyone that you know might have had the flu or other respiratory viruses or covid like you just don’t treat those patients.

So that was a huge blessing but knowing that they were like 10 feet away Was awful. but the, the breathing, like just literally breathing in a mask for nine hours a day, 39, 40, and then 41 weeks pregnant, like that was a struggle for sure 

[00:11:36] Kiona: Yeah, I get that because people that are pregnant struggle to breathe without a mask, just the day to day. So I get that and I definitely also understand the anxiety behind knowing that even if your patient is COVID free in room one. The person in room two has COVID and the person that is caring for them comes out that door and walks past you.

And us also knowing that it’s like an airborne virus, like how much can you really prevent it from getting to you within that 10 feet of difference, even though it’s a six foot protocol, but you know, this person in this room has this. So. Yeah, I understand that anxiety for sure.

So how did you, like, did your workplace require you to get vaccines when they came out? Or was that something that was not mandated at your location?

[00:12:27] Athena: So it was not mandated in the beginning, and I think that was before it became the series of three vaccines. So at the time, we had choice. and then they announced that the larger hospitals, like the bigger ones here in Jacksonville, which I won’t name, but they were making it mandatory.

 So being that it was such a new vaccine and that I was already, six, seven months pregnant. I just decided at that time that I was not going to get the vaccine.

[00:12:55] Kiona: Yeah, and I totally understand that. I think that that’s a good decision to make because I also found out that I was pregnant with my third. When the vaccines first started coming out and I was like, I don’t know how I feel about this, I don’t know how I feel about this.

This is new. It’s scary because there’s no research done. They don’t even know if pregnant people can, if there’s going to be an effect on the baby or anything like that. So I 100 percent understand that decision.

[00:13:16] Athena: Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was interesting, but we made it.

[00:13:20] Kiona: Yeah, we’re on the other side or so we think. Yeah,

[00:13:23] Athena: Right.

[00:13:26] Kiona: so throughout your pregnancy with being around in that workplace, did you find yourself coming home with loss of anxiety throughout your pregnancy as well, like did you bring that anxiety from the workplace to your home or were you kind of like when I get home I kind of have this time of decompress in order to prepare for the next day?

[00:13:49] Athena: It was kind of a little bit of both, to be honest. I think when it first came out, so I had her in June, and it really, like, quote unquote, like, came out in, what, like, March, right? So, I think around that time, it was kind of still, like, so new, so many unknowns,but then, when you’re obviously working in a hospital, you’re seeing these people firsthand, and then you’re watching the news and seeing a bunch of young people start dying. that definitely gave me anxiety, but I think I got in such a good routine of like, the crazy days.

When you would, at least for me, I’d get home, change in the garage, everything comes off. throw on my robe, run up the stairs, get in the shower, wash my hair, do everything every single day, which is so annoying and monotonous. But you know, I think it brought me a little bit of peace during that time. So I’m grateful for that.

But yeah, I mean, I think the anxiety was like a baseline issue the whole second half of the pregnancy for sure.

[00:14:52] Kiona: Yeah, that makes a ton of sense, and I can relate to that whole garage, taking off clothes in the garage, because my husband works in a hospital. He’s not a doctor, he’s, a telehealth technician, so a communication technician that works on all of the… technical stuff with like, you know, yeah, he’s that, I don’t know his language, but he does that. And so basically saying he would work in the hospital and he would be having to run wire for COVID units. And he would having to, like, be all dressed up and stuff. And of course, with it being the height of the pandemic, we’re like, you need to like, do all the things you need to. Change your clothes, you need to run upstairs, take a shower, like, sanitize the knobs after you touch them, like, everything.

So I understand that for sure. That was definitely a thing in our household as well.

[00:15:39] Athena: Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

[00:15:40] Kiona: Yeah, so as we move further into your pregnancy, we’re getting near the end. was there anything throughout your pregnancy that you were able to access in order to prepare for childbirth in the ending days of your pregnancy?

[00:15:53] Athena: Yeah. So We went to a really efficient hospital class just for, expecting parents. that was the one thing that was not canceled during COVID, which was a huge blessing. it was in a big like conference room at the hospital where I delivered and there was probably six or seven couples and they had us, at tables, but very far apart.

we got to watch a couple videos of a couple different births, and then the nurse that instructed the course, she took us through, like, different positions that you could try, like, if you’re starting to feel contractions, how to keep things moving as long as you can. A bunch of different tips that I thought were helpful.

so that was fantastic that we still got to attend that. And then I have a couple friends back home in Ohio that are, pelvic health physical therapists. So they kind of gave me, some basic like exercises and then breathing activities to do, like when I was getting into pre labor and labor.

So those were things that I kind of had in the back pocket. And then I did make a bunch of note cards just on index cards about, when you’re in this position, try this, when you’re doing this, try this. and then I did write, multiple Bible verses down on those cards just so when I got to the point where, I was in the bed getting ready to give birth, I could kind of, roll through those cards and just remember the things that, I’d been preparing for because I knew in the moment, your mind’s gonna be a million places, 

[00:17:19] Kiona: Yeah, yeah, and I love that you did that. I love that you took the initiative and put in the effort to actually write those note cards for yourself, because it’s different than, even though affirmation cards that are pre made are great, The cards you made for yourself were very personalized. Like, you got to decide what to put on them.

You know what would be said or what verse would work for you and make you feel a certain way to get you through to that next push or that next contraction in your labor. So I think that that’s super awesome.

[00:17:49] Athena: Aw, thanks. Mm-Hmm.

[00:17:50] Kiona: Yeah! I also love that you utilized the resources that you had with your friends that are physical therapists, but specifically for the pelvic floor or pelvic health.

I think that’s amazing because Not many people think of that, even though, your pelvic floor is what is holding up all that baby weight, so it is impacted regardless of which way your birth happens, so, I guess a random question is, as a physical therapist yourself, would you recommend, pelvic floor therapy for people, all people that carry babies, or would you say only people that are experiencing specific symptoms?

[00:18:31] Athena: hmm. Oh, that’s such a good question. So I think my pelvic floor friends would say everybody and I, I agree with that because I just think that if you can control your pelvic floor, then you know what pushing during a contraction should feel like. Like, when you get to be pushing, I think when you learn how to control that musculature, it teaches your nervous system and those muscles how to contract and perform their best function in those moments.

So, yeah, I mean, I definitely think it can be beneficial.

[00:19:03] Kiona: Yeah. And so you’re saying it would be beneficial both during the pregnancy and postpartum as well, just for the healing aspect.

[00:19:10] Athena: Absolutely. Yeah. I think,I still have to do some more work postpartum, as far as the pelvic floor. And I just think it, it kind of ebbs and flows with time. So like personally, like prenatal, I did some of those things on my own just cause it was the height of COVID. I really didn’t want to go to another practitioner in office.

So my friends from home kind of helped me virtually and now postpartum I have gone to a woman for the Pelvic floor, but I think it’s something that you could always use almost like a tune-up Because think you know, it just depends like for me I didn’t have any issues until my daughter was about 14 months when I really got back into running consistently.

And then I kind of noticed like, Ooh, I’m kind of leaking a little bit like that hasn’t happened ever. So why is that resurfacing? so that’s when I started to see her. And then, I had taken over and continue the program on my own. And that’s what I’ve been doing. But now, to this day, even with a three year old, my husband and I like to do those HIIT workouts, like the high intensity interval training. And I noticed like if we do anything plyometric, like the box jumps or like the jump squats or sometimes even burpees, I’m kind of like, Oh, squeeze your cheeks.

[00:20:25] Kiona: Yeah.

[00:20:27] Athena: So it’s just, yeah, yeah. So I think it’s another one of those taboo topics.

Like I just don’t think it’s talked about enough.

[00:20:33] Kiona: Yeah. Yeah. I agree. I mean, and it’s interesting because I didn’t realize. I mean, I knew the importance of pelvic floor health and pelvic floor therapy, but even with being a birth worker, I haven’t ever utilized those services. And I’m over here telling everybody like, yes, do it, do it, do it.

And I have a 10, 6 and 2 year old, so I’m like, it ain’t too late. I got time. I can definitely still utilize those services and maybe I will, why not to do that. Tune up or just to even see what way. My baseline is now, you know,

and just see because it is a muscle, it can be worked. And most people, I think, think about pelvic floor muscles more specifically with like intimacy, but there’s other things like, yeah, it could benefit in intimacy, but there’s other things like just not like not peeing when you sneeze

or, doing a box jump, not doing a little tinkle. So yeah, yeah, I get that for sure. That’s awesome. so let’s go ahead and start diving into the birth of Cecilia. So tell me when you realized that you were in labor.

[00:21:42] Athena: Okay. I wish I knew that I was in labor. So I went in for my 40 week checkup and I’ll keep this as abbreviated as I can. So I went in for my 40 week, the doctor who I was, my favorite, the one who I planned to be there to deliver her. Who was my primary of the group. she checked me and she was like, you are hard as a rock.

Like your cervix is not even softened. And I was like, Oh great. What does that mean? And she was like, that means that nothing is happening. And I was like, okay, so am I dilated? And she’s like, no.

[00:22:14] Kiona: Oh no, at 40 weeks

[00:22:16] Athena: So at 40 weeks, so I was like I’m really ready. Like I am a type a planner.

Like my friends know this about me. My coworkers know this about me. I was so ready to meet this baby. I was like super athletic, consistent runner. Whatever. So she’s like, I’ll see you in a week. If I don’t see you before that. I said, okay. So I go to my 41 week appointment. I met with one of the different doctors.

She was in a birth that day. And they were like, yeah, your cervix is still like really hard. It is barely softened. And I was like, Am I dilated? She’s like, no. So we had the conversation about going to 42 weeks, but the hospital that I delivered at, they’re very strict about 41 weeks. So, I didn’t have any like history with a doula or a midwife or anything like that because at the time doulas couldn’t come into the hospital.

So to me, and when I talked to my husband, Chris about it, we did meet with two women that were doulas. And, I just felt like, if you can teach me everything, but you can’t be in the trenches with me, like, what is the purpose? At least for me, that’s kind of how I felt.

So, my husband is a super supportive person in general, so I knew that he would be able to handle it, at least I assumed, which he did. He did great. But, that’s kind of why we didn’t have a doula involved. So, The 41 week checkup, she says, you know, you’re not dilated. We should, admit you tonight and start the Cervidil.

So Cervidil is like a cervical ripening agent. They place on your cervix and then you sleep normally for 12 hours. And then at 12 hours, they normally take it out and then check your dilation. So they admitted me right away from that appointment. I went down to the car, got my stuff. That admission was actually somewhat traumatic because my mom was visiting from Ohio preparing to like have her grandchild a week ago and She’s waiting for me in the car and I kind of like tap on the window I’m like mom they want to admit me now and she’s like, okay, let’s go and I was like, but Chris is still working So my husband also is a physical therapist.

He was like wrapping up the day. We had no idea that I would get like directly admitted. So I call him at the office. I’m like, Hey, like you have to finish. Get your stuff at the house. Like let the dogs out. We got to go. So my mom helps me with like my eighteen hundred bags. And, uh, we get to the lobby and there’s like this big old security man.

He’s like, ladies, I’m so sorry, but she cannot escort you up to labor and delivery. And I was like, Oh, it’s my first baby. My husband is still at work. my mom’s just going to help me get my stuff up to the room. And he’s like, no ma’am, you can’t come in.

[00:24:54] Kiona: Hmm.

[00:24:55] Athena: So I kinda didn’t know what to do. I felt like a deer in headlight moment. So I was just kind of staring at him and staring at her and I didn’t know what to do. So what else does another pregnant, woman do? I just started crying and he was like, Oh no, no, no, I’m so sorry. And I was like, Oh, don’t be sorry. It’s just policy because of COVID and he’s like gosh, honey, I’m so sorry. He’s like, I’ll call a nurse. We’ll get your stuff.

I’m like, okay. So I hugged my mom and this nurse gets me up to the floor, that precious security guard, I guess, like, let my mom leave and then followed her outside and said, you know, I’m so sorry, it’s just policy, which I thought was so nice.

[00:25:34] Kiona: Yeah. That’s super nice.

[00:25:36] Athena: So, yeah, so, they walk me up to the unit and, it’s like 7pm, they start my IV, um, they get the cervidil in and they’re kind of just like, alright, we’ll just monitor and see what happens. And I said, okay, so I just hung out, tried to watch TV. He got there about seven 30. and then, they’re like, all right, have a good night sleep. And I was like, who’s sleeping? I can’t sleep. Like what?

[00:26:02] Kiona: Like, I’m here now. Things are supposed to be happening now,

[00:26:06] Athena: we like watched a show, I don’t think I, I don’t remember anything from that. I just remember being like, all right, I’m ready to go. So of course my husband falls asleep. He’s snoring like a little bear. And the nurse came to check on me around like midnight and she was like, Oh, you’re still awake.

And I was like, how can I fall asleep right now? And she’s like, well, you, do you want to try, I think it was a Benadryl. I think she gave me like the lowest dose possible. of Benadryl, I think. Maybe I shouldn’t put, maybe I shouldn’t put that out there. I don’t know.

[00:26:39] Kiona: it’s, it sounds, it sounds normal. It sounds like the common thing that is offered to pregnant people that are trying to sleep is Benadryl.

[00:26:46] Athena: Yeah. So she, she offered me like the lowest dose possible. And I said, all right, so I think I slept till four and then the nurse and the doctor, my doctor come in at five and they’re like, all right, let’s check, And she’s like, Ooh, I said, is it that bad? And she said, well, you’re one centimeter dilated. And I said, okay, so what does that mean? And she’s like, well, you should probably get moving and see if you can make anything happen. I said, all right. So this was all pre intervention. So I start walking the halls, it’s COVID so it’s a locked unit, can’t get anywhere. So I start doing like lunges and squats and deep squats and these like forward bent over things.

I can’t remember what they’re called and we’re moving, moving, moving. And then one o’clock rolls around and she’s like, yep, you’re still one centimeter. I’m like, sweet. That’s great. So, she’s like, we’ll let you go a little bit longer, but you should think about having us break your water.

And I was like, Oh, I really didn’t want to do that. I read a book that you’re not supposed to.

[00:27:47] Kiona: Mm-Hmm.

[00:27:48] Athena: My nurse is like, well, let’s just keep our options open because we, want to get that baby out. I said, all right. So I walked until three at three, they came back and said, we’ll check you.

I was still one. So they broke my water. and then I tried to labor naturally for about an hour. Nothing happening. So then they recommended that I start Pitocin, which that’s, an IV drug that’s used to help, create contraction in the uterus. So for me, I really didn’t want that. I had plenty of friends that had birthed babies after Pitocin, and I feel like it went 50 50. Half of my friends were like, those contractions almost killed me, and then the other half were like, Oh, I got the 10 centimeters and pushed out my baby without an epidural. I was like, alright, well, that’s where we are. So they start the Pitocin.

I’m like walking around the hall with the IV. I’m walking, walking, walking for about an hour. And then, the pain just got, like, so unbearable. Like, I felt like my back was just gonna, like, snap in half. Which, I know, obviously, anatomically, cannot happen. But, just, like, the cramping and, like, the uncomfortable, feeling of it, I guess. So, I go to the room and I’m kinda like… I don’t want to say crying, just kind of like grunting, but like whimpering, I guess. And the nurse comes in and, she already knew I really didn’t want any intervention, but we’re already, we’re already way past that. So she said, maybe we should talk about an epidural.

And I, I kicked everyone else that was in the room out. I said, everyone needs to leave. I just want to talk to Ariel. That was my main nurse for daytime and my husband, Chris. And she said, listen, you want to look back on this and enjoy, your birth story. Like you don’t want to look back in anger.

And, think about how miserable you were. And I said, yeah, you’re not wrong. So she’s like, I’m going to step out and you guys can like, talk about everything. See if you think that you want the epidural or if you want to keep trying without it, I swear it was like the heavens opened and she left the room and I was sitting there and it was like the worst contract.

I just looked at the monitor and I was like. I might die. And then with the Pitocin and that, it just was like confirmation, like you do not want this to be your story. So I had a really good cry. My poor husband, he calls it the Kim Kardashian cry, which, you know, we all know what that looks like.

Okay. So, he said, wow, you let out a good Kim K cry. And I said, listen, this is not what I wanted. Like none of this was what I wanted. I didn’t want COVID to be around when I was pregnant. I wanted to have my family here. Like, just so many emotions. So it just showed that the whole birth process is just so much out of your hands.

Right? So, I had a good cry. The Kim K cry. I hit the buzzer for her. She comes in. I’m like, yeah, it’s time. Well, then she tells me, Oh, there’s four moms in front of you now. And I was like, great. So I sat, I kneeled in, kind of like an all fours posture for a while just to kind of get through some more contractions.

And, I finally got, got up to three centimeters, but, he came around, I think, five 40. With the epidural and oh my God, it was like the best moment of my life. I was like, give me the juice. So, he was lovely. I had no pain. I could still feel my right leg a little bit, like just the sensation of it.

Like my left leg was numb. So like if I were laying on my back and had my feet flat on the bed with my knees in the air, the left leg would just flop to the side. Like it was a goner. But the right leg, I could still move in and out. I could still bend and straighten it. So that I was kind of thankful for it to be honest.

So I could actually like feel the pressure. So then around 6 30, I started really, really feeling it. They came in, they said, Oh, we got to go. So my doctor comes in, they get her all dressed and all this stuff real fast. And then I pushed for 18 minutes, so I don’t really know if that’s good or bad. To me, I was just glad.

Like, I was like, I don’t even care. Like, I’m just ready. I’m, I’m so ready to hold this baby and know what it is because we didn’t know the gender. So, it was almost like, let’s solve the mystery and like, move forward, I guess. So, it was really, really cool. My doctor, Dr. Keenan, she is like one of my favorite humans on this planet.

She said to Chris, she said, do you want to announce the gender? And he, he goes, am I allowed? And she, she said, yeah, of course. Like if you want to say what it is, absolutely. So he was way more in the scene than I thought he would have been. he, he told me the whole time I was pregnant, I’ll, I’ll be up by your head.

I’ll do whatever you want, but I’m staying by your head. I’m like, okay. So when it came down to it, they had my legs in the stirrup and he was holding the one leg and he was very involved. He kept like looking and I was like, please stop looking. But, um, he just was in it. So, I pushed her out on that last push and I’m just waiting on the next contraction to push out the shoulders and I get the shoulders out, you know, everything’s great.

And then I’m just kind of saying like, what is it, what is it, what is it? And he kind of looks down and Dr. Keenan’s like, go ahead. And he said, it’s a girl. And there, oh my God, there was probably. 18 people in the room because so many other nurses like wanted to come in and see what it was and all of that cause we’d already been there for over 24 hours.

And so, he says it’s a girl in this like big erupts, applause. It was just really, really cute.

[00:33:32] Kiona: Aw. That sounds amazing.

[00:33:34] Athena: Yeah. Yeah. It was really cool. It was really cool. So I was like super against not finding out the gender, but then he kind of like talked me into it. And his reasoning was just kind of like, there’s very few, like, pure, complete surprises in this lifetime. Like, we can predict and Google and, all the things, but he kept telling me, he’s like, listen, this is something that you’ll have no idea.

And unless they accidentally tell us, we’ll have no clue. So why not let it be a surprise? And I’m very like, Nope. I need this color. I need this da da da. I need that. You know, everything has to line up lovely. But, we agreed on like a sage green, like ivory theme for her room. So I was like, either way, like that could be for both.

And then I was kind of like, alright, we’ll do it. so I was begrudgingly agreeable to that, but now looking back, like if we ever got pregnant again, I would 100 percent not find out again.

[00:34:33] Kiona: I love that. And I’m slightly envious of you because I’ve tried to do that twice now and it hasn’t worked, it just never works because we always go in to our ultrasounds, like our anatomy scan. And we’re like, we’re falling into the pressure of being like, okay, just tell us what it is, you know? Um, but I think that’s so beautiful and I love how you guys got to experience that surprise and the applause and everybody on your team was also just like, so in love with the.

Just the fact that you guys had a girl, they were just like, yeah, like, that’s so cool. You know, I am a strong believer that every person that has a baby deserves a ginormous round of applause. So

[00:35:14] Athena: I love that 

[00:35:15] Kiona: think that’s awesome. Yeah. I think it’s awesome that you received that. And, I also wanted to go back a little bit in your story and say that it’s super awesome that your nurse had that conversation with you about, how do you want to look back at your birth and how do you want to remember it? Because, yes. You could have still continued to push through and try to have, you know, an unmedicated birth. But one thing that I say all the time you as the birthing person, as the pregnant person, the one that is going through labor, You are the one that knows your line between coping and suffering.

And so when you decide that you are no longer coping through things and it’s suffering, it has a very, very, very high chance of becoming a traumatic experience rather than a happy experience. So I think it’s awesome that your nurse did that conversation with you. So

[00:36:08] Athena: Oh, thanks.

[00:36:10] Kiona: Yeah. So. After you guys had Cecilia, and you looked at her, were you like, Oh my gosh, she’s definitely a Cecilia.

[00:36:19] Athena: So that’s another funny thing is that, so we had to have like both sets of names. So for a boy, like we both agreed hardcore, like we came to an agreement on a name, like that was the name regardless of what he looked like. We just like loved it that much. But for the girl name, I don’t know what it was.

I just feel like girl names for us are so much harder. Like, I don’t know if it’s that I’m pickier about girl names or if I like know people with that name that I like wouldn’t want to name my child or what it is, but I just felt like every name I gave him, he was like, no, no, oh no. And I was like, okay.

And then, I was telling you this pre recording, he kind of just came home from work one day and said, Oh, what about Cecilia? And I was like, Oh, Cecilia. Okay. All right. And then I looked at him and I was like, yeah, I was like, we could call her Cece. And he said, yeah. I was like, all right. I like that.

It’s an option, but I still like, wasn’t a hundred percent. So we saw her and then. It was just like almost immediate, like I was like, okay, yeah, like you’re Cecilia for sure. And I don’t know if it was like the fact that it was her, or we just love that name so much, but, all the other names I was thinking, they just like weren’t even on the top of my mind anymore.

It was just like, Cecilia was right there, so it was just kinda like, yup you’re Cecilia.

[00:37:44] Kiona: Mm. I love that. I love that. And I feel like people don’t talk about their naming journeys for their babies very much. It’s just like, Oh, this is, this is James. Or, this is Amber. You know, and it’s just their names. And there’s definitely a journey behind choosing a name, because of what you just said.

Like, I have some friends who are teachers, and that makes it really hard for them to find a name for their kids because they’re like, oh, I have this student named Jeffrey in my class, and I cannot, I cannot imagine my son being named Jeffrey. And so I feel like teachers have it so much harder.

Because they’re either like, oh, I love Kaylee. Kaylee is so nice. And then they’re like, but I know five Kaylees, So

[00:38:26] Athena: Right.

[00:38:27] Kiona: the journey of naming is a thing in itself. So I appreciate you sharing that part of your story.

[00:38:32] Athena: Yeah.

[00:38:34] Kiona: Yeah. So now you have Cecilia in your arms, and you and Chris are there holding her and embracing being a family.

How is your first few days postpartum?

[00:38:49] Athena: So it was super weird for me to like not have anyone come visit us at the hospital. Like that was super, super just odd. Like my mom was three miles down the road at our house. And just knowing like my mom is sitting in my house three miles away and she’s gonna meet her last because she doesn’t have FaceTime.

I don’t even remember if her smartphone I mean, obviously it had a camera, but like, I don’t even think she had zoom back then. So it was just, that part was so weird for me. So we did get to zoom a lot of our family and friends from the hospital. So that was nice. my sister and her family and my sister in law and my mother in law, but my dad nor my mom had zoom or FaceTime at the time.

So called both of them, obviously told them the story, but my mom met her two days later on the seventh, which was awesome. That was so fun. And then she stayed, I think another five days. so that was great. She was there like her whole first week almost. And then, I had a lot of visitors when we first got home, but I was like very particular.

So. The only visitor who I let from the nursing facility where I work was my best friend Kelly and her husband Kurt. And that’s just because we’re just so crazy close. And I didn’t want to put the baby at risk to meet too many people. So it was like, I would have like one visitor a day and that was it.

And some of my friends that I allowed come, they work at home. So I knew that they were remote. So they were really only spending time with their spouses who also work from home. So that was nice, but it was also weird. Cause then you’ve got everybody else. That’s like, when do we get to meet the baby?

And I was like, well, take a number maybe in three months.

[00:40:41] Kiona: Yeah, Yeah,

And then also COVID is still like, you know, you said you had her in June, so you had her during the warmer months. So COVID isn’t as active necessarily, but as the year goes on, you know, it’s just like flu season, COVID season starts coming around again. And so you’re like, Oh, we got to pull this back.

We got to reign this back a little. do some COVID testing before you come in my house. like, are you negative? Do you have any signs or symptoms and everything, which is stressful.

[00:41:08] Athena: Yeah. Yeah. It was super weird, super weird.

[00:41:11] Kiona: Mm hmm. So let’s dive a little bit more into what your postpartum looked like.

[00:41:18] Athena: So I was doing really well with her for like the first, me mentally and me physically were great. Like for the first, four or five months, I did breastfeed, which was a very rewarding journey, but very, very stressful for me because she was a very long eater and she would barely get.

You know anything I can’t remember the exact ounces I have it all charted in her first year of life book that I made Just because I wanted it to one day look back on. I haven’t looked at it yet I’m, just not ready yet, but it was just very like Honestly exhausting because she would eat You know, one side would take her 20 minutes and then she wouldn’t be full.

So I’d put her on the other side, another 20, 25 minutes. And then, she might sleep or play for a little bit or whatever. And then I’m pumping within, an hour or what it wasn’t. And then it would repeat and then I’d wake up at night to pump. And then, so that was just, I think that just added a level of stress because.

She was born very small. So I hadn’t mentioned that yet. So when she was born, they estimated that she would be seven pounds, six ounces. So I was like, okay, great. Like average baby, right? She came out and she was 513. So I was already like super stressed out. Like why was she so small? Like so many questions.

[00:42:43] Kiona: Yeah, because she was born at 41 weeks. So she was held extra, and she was still 5 pounds, 13 ounces.

[00:42:50] Athena: right. Yeah, so that was super crazy. And then she lost weight coming home. So we went to the doctor, you know, that three day appointment, like once you’re home, you go back and she still hadn’t gained back to her birth weight. She was 5’8 for I think like 10 days. So I had to go and do a weight check with her every other day for those 10 days just so they could keep eyes on her.

I was seeing two different lactation consultants at my house, like virtually. And by day, maybe 14 of her life, she had slowly started gaining a couple ounces, ounces, like not a lot. And I did have a baby scale. So it was a continual, feed, feed, pump, weigh, feed, feed, pump, weigh, monitor the poopy diapers, the pee diapers, like everything you could imagine.

We were monitoring it. So it was just a lot. I didn’t expect a fraction of that. So to have it be so much all at once, it was just a lot.

[00:43:51] Kiona: Yeah. I mean, that is a lot. And The feeding session length has a huge impact on your experience with breastfeeding, and I know that that goes, like, people assume, like, yeah, that goes hand in hand, but the amount, you, you kind of hope, at least for me, coming from my personal side, I hope that when I nurse my baby for 15 minutes, 20 minutes, they’re getting enough, but when they’re not full, you’re like, wait, but we were just doing this for, 25 minutes, and it felt like hours because I feel like I’m doing this all the time, and so it’s just this cycle of pump, feed, do you have a poopy diaper, do you have a wet diaper, weigh, all that stuff, like all of that, I, that definitely is not talked about enough pre Pre baby, like during your pregnancy, before even conception, people don’t talk enough about the little things that will need to be monitored in order to, like, ensure that your baby is healthy or, following their projected weight trajectory.

So that’s a lot and I commend you for getting through it because that takes a superwoman to do. So good job.

[00:45:09] Athena: Thank you. You’re so sweet.

[00:45:13] Kiona: Yeah, it’s definitely a journey. So I know that you created your podcast and your blog specifically because of your postpartum experience. So let’s dive into a little bit of what things you were experiencing that led you to creating your platform.

[00:45:28] Athena: Sure. So, I think that my postpartum depression really was situational. like I said, she was born very small. We had a very difficult time getting weight on her. she was in like the 10 percentile till she was about four months old. And then around that time at that four month old appointment, the pediatrician had just mentioned to me, she has a flat spot.

So you should, think about getting a helmet, we’ll see her next month. And if it’s not any better at her six months, you probably need to get her fitted. And I was kind of taken aback, like, what are you talking about? And, our doctor was wonderful. I still appreciate him to this day. but it was just something that I was not prepared for, you know, just another thing to kind of add to the stack, I guess, if you want to say it in that way, that I felt like was just kind of like, okay, what next? So he mentioned physical therapy, which as good physical therapy parents, we took her to a pediatric physical therapist. She did have torticollis. That’s when your muscle that attaches from your collarbone to the base of your skull, it’s called your sternocleidomastoid.

So when that gets super tight, it can cause a rotation in the neck where if you see those kids. where their head’s kind of cocked to the one side. It looks like their ear’s closer to the same shoulder and the chin’s pointing the other direction. That is a child that has torticollis. So if that’s not treated.

They keep growing and developing and that muscle tightness remains. So what that can affect is your positioning, your spine. it can lead toward, scoliosis. Like there’s just so many different things that can come from that. So we went to physical therapy. We got all the stretches, the exercises we carried through.

I thought it was getting better. and then at her six month It was kind of just affirmed like, Nope, it did not work. you need to continue the therapy and we need to get her fitted for a helmet if that’s what you choose. So that was just kind of like the straw that broke the camel’s back as they say.

And it’s finally a topic that I can like successfully talk about without crying, because I feel like for me, I didn’t know anyone in my circle whose child ever had a helmet and it’s not the aesthetics. Like I could care less if she had to wear something to be different. Obviously I’m a physical therapist.

I do that for a living. So I work with people who wear braces, like leg braces. I work with amputees. I work with stroke patients like I’m used to adaptive equipment. Things that make people different. Like that’s fine. It had nothing to do with the aesthetics. It was just kind of like one more thing that I’m doing wrong as a new mom.

So for me, it was kind of just like, great. Another thing that I’m failing at. And now she has a flat head. So, like any other type, a mom, new mom, I went and got three opinions and. I just wanted to know beyond a shadow of a doubt, this is something that she medically needs. I wanted to make sure that I just got all the information that I wanted.

So at the third orthotist’s office, I kind of was just talking to him about, like this is my insurance. This is what is covered by insurance and it was not a money decision. That’s not what held me back. It was more so. Is it something that she truly needs? Like, is this flat spot going to be there for five months or for 50 years?

You know? So when I went to the third one, I kind of just asked him every question that I had cause it was just like the final thing. So, he talked to me about all the different angles of the skull and I won’t get into all that, but what I was kind of telling him was this is a very expensive helmet out of pocket and my insurance only covers it if it’s X amount of degrees.

And he said, first thing out of his mouth was, Have you gotten any other opinions? And I laughed and I said, You know I have. And he said, well, what did they say? And I said, they both said it was 8 degrees. So the differentiation of the angles of the skull was 8 

degrees

[00:49:28] Kiona: hmm. 

[00:49:29] Athena: And you know it has to be this certain number for insurance to cover it. And so he put her on the little baby conveyor belt, they like strap the little head in and then they put them under and this little light beam goes over their forehead for like three seconds, maybe a little bit longer, and then they take them out and you pick them up, they’re fine, they don’t even cry, it’s very fast.

So I looked at him and I was like, sir, I really need it to be like this amount of degrees, so that way it would be covered. And he was like, honey, I’m so sorry, like, it is eight degrees. And so, that let out a good cry and some emotion and he said, but you know, this is what she needs. Like if this is, it’s, it’s yours and your husband’s decision, but you know, we show, it’s eight degrees of differentiation. So I get home, Chris gets home. We kind of talk about everything, obviously we chose to do it. it was out of pocket, which sucked, but at least I knew that I was doing everything possible for the baby. So it was almost like a slight sense of peace, but like a huge sense of failure. So

in between the time of that third appointment and getting fitted for the helmet, I just started getting like, extreme anxiety, like could not eat straight up insomnia.

The third orthotic appointment was the fourth. Starting January 5th was just like, I became like a full blown insomniac. Like laying in bed, but eyes open staring at the ceiling or tossing and turning and then sleep became like this black cloud that would just follow me and I would just like Perseverate and ruminate on like will I sleep tonight?

Like am I gonna be able to take a nap when she naps? What will I be able to do like da da da da da da da? So it just became like this whole monster and That just kind of led to like my whole downfall

[00:51:22] Kiona: Yeah, that sounds tough. That sounds tough. And I want you to continue, but I just want to touch on a couple of things and say, you probably know this already, but it never hurts to hear again. You are so freaking strong to be able to go through all of that. Like, that is such a huge thing. And those postpartum moments, like, especially immediately postpartum, the first, we’re postpartum forever, but especially that first year of trying to figure it out, you went through so much in the first few months just to make sure that your daughter had what she needed in order to be healthy and thrive.

And it sucks that in the U. S. We have to worry about how much it costs. It sucks so bad for us to not be able to just have the resources that we need at our fingertips. And that, honestly, for me to say that is like, makes me sound like a first world snob because there are so many other countries out there in the world that don’t have anything close to what we have.

But I really wish that everywhere on Earth was universal healthcare and preventative care, And then us to also get the resources that we need when we need them. Okay, but I also want to say you are not alone in the experiences that you had, and I know that when you were going through that, you probably felt like you were because you had this cloud of struggling to sleep and also struggling to even feel, like I heard you say multiple times, that you were a failure as a mom.

Because of these things that you had no control over, you had no control over these things and you felt like a failure and that is so hard for me to hear because I can relate on some of the things that I felt I failed at. And now that I’m on the other side, and now that I’m seeing there are babies being born around me, I’m seeing some of my close friends struggling in their postpartum feeling, literally saying, I feel like I’m failing.

I feel like I am failing. And so I just want to say to you, you’re amazing. You’re a badass mom. And I barely, I literally, like, I don’t even know you, but I know that, like, just hearing your story. And this is amazing on hearing all the things that you got through. And so I want to commend you for making all the decisions that you had to make in order to ensure that. Your family was okay, and that your daughter was thriving. So,

[00:53:54] Athena: Thank you. Thank you so much.

[00:53:57] Kiona: yeah but let’s go ahead and continue to move forward, because during, when you filled out the guest request form, you had also mentioned that there were 37 days. 37 days between the moment that you first realized that you needed help to when you received it. So, let’s talk about that.

[00:54:16] Athena: Okay, so my husband and I, so I went insomnia for about three days and then I called the OB. Hindsight, I probably should have called sooner, like that first night or two where things had gotten wonky. so I contacted my OB by day three and told her about the not sleeping, the not eating, just the incessant anxiety so she prescribed Zoloft for the anxiety and then a low dose of Ambien for sleep. So she said, let’s try this for three nights and see if your sleep gets better. So I said, okay. So we did that and I hate to say it, so the Ambien like knocked me out, completely unconscious, wake up, but there was like no rest.

So it just kind of felt like I closed my eyes and then I opened them five minutes later and it was like, okay, what happened? and obviously, we all know now those antidepressants can take weeks. So that was kind of its own, thing. I knew that that would take a while, but for me, I was like, I just need to be able to feel like a human who can function.

So I called her back and I said, I’m so sorry to say it’s just not working. it’s not helping at all. So she said, maybe you need to start looking for a psychiatrist. And I was like, I don’t know. I don’t even know how to find one, so she, told me about, psychiatry today. She got on the website with me, which I thought was super nice of her. help me look up the providers, see if they were taking new patients. And, you know, remember everybody, we’re still talking January, 2021. So you’re still talking. This is like the re emergence of COVID now.

So now this is like round two of when COVID spiked. So. I’m calling psychiatrists with my husband that next day and they’re talking a six month wait list, a year wait list. And I said, I said to my husband the one day, I said, what if I want to kill myself today? Like, I’m not saying I want to, but like, where am I supposed to go for help?

Am I supposed to call 911? Like, what are our options? And he said, well, we have to find someone to see you. So we kept looking, looking, looking, looking, looking. I saw a name come up who was a child psychiatrist actually, but he had a nurse practitioner working with him. And I thought, if I can’t get a psychiatrist, I will try a nurse practitioner.

So I filled out the form, I laid out everything, how I have for y’all. And the secretary called me and said, he can see you in two days. And I said, what? So, I got on board. He saw me, at that time, the day before I had that appointment, I had called my dad for the second time. I called him a couple weeks prior.

He knew I was struggling. I called him for the second time and I said, dad, I’m really struggling. Like I’m barely hanging on.

And he said, okay. He said, I’m packing a bag and I’m getting in the car and he lives in Ohio. So I was like, what do you mean? And he said, I’m coming. And I said, okay. So he drove down, he was there for me for that appointment the next day. So it was him, my husband and myself on the zoom call with this nurse practitioner.

And it was the first time that I felt a little bit of peace. So we started the journey of, messing with different sleep medications. we kept the Zoloft the same for awhile and our key was just the sleep. So we started going through, a couple of different benzos and a couple of different SSRIs for sleep.

And we did that for about two weeks and it just was not working, same story. It would help me ease into sleep and then I just never felt rested. I just really couldn’t, I couldn’t figure that out. It was like this looming sense of anxiety. I just, it wasn’t working. So we got a referral from someone who I knew at the hospital where I was working and they said, this psychiatrist is the head of psychiatry at the hospital. You should call him. He has an office. So I called. They got me in. And he switched me from the Zoloft to Seroquel. And he wanted to do a higher dose to help me sleep. So we started around a hundred milligrams. The one night didn’t work. Went to 200 milligrams, didn’t work, went to 300. And then by the time we got to 400 on day 4 of that, I just told him, I said, I’m just not comfortable, like, keeping increasing this. And then it became the game of I’ve taken 12 medications in the last 30 days and you’re talking to someone who takes a prenatal, that’s it.

So, that was also a mind game. So, At that point I told him, I said, I’m so sorry, but I just don’t feel comfortable taking this at home. And he said, well, if you can’t follow the regimen at home, then you need to be admitted to the hospital so I can monitor you. So that was its own mind game because the hospital that he was the psychiatrist for was the hospital that I worked at. So imagine, thinking about going to the place where you work, you know, all the nurses on all the floors, even in labor and delivery. And you’re going to go there to be on the psych unit. I mean, that’s what it is. It’s like, it’s a psychiatry specialized unit. And I fought that for about a week and we kept playing the game just with the medications.

And, and I don’t say playing the game lightly. I’m not, taking the weight off of that at all. I’m just saying it was almost like, We have to figure out what works, and until we know, we have to switch it up. That’s what I mean when I say that. I’m not trying to, take light of the situation or anything like that.

So, by the time I agree to go to the hospital, my dad is in town. He’s the one who actually drove me to the hospital and I think I still feel some guilt about that just because You know as a parent like I can’t imagine the emotion that he felt like knowing there’s nothing I can do to help her and If this hospital unit can help her, then she needs to go.

So I’ll take her. That happened on February 12th. So 37 days of just looking for answers, kind of finding answers, not finding answers, and it led me to that.

[01:00:38] Kiona: Yeah, and I just want to also give your dad a giant high five, giant bear hug for being there and dropping everything he had to be by your side, during both times. You know, I think that’s awesome. And I, I also luckily have a father who would have done the same. but I am happy that you had that for you and I’m happy that you had your husband by your side to also be able to have those conversations and kind of fill the gap when you couldn’t do much, when you were just at your lowest low.

So I want to commend both of those great men in your life 

[01:01:15] Athena: Aww. 

[01:01:17] Kiona: Yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s so important. so. Yeah, when you got to the hospital and checked in, how long were you there?

[01:01:26] Athena: so I was there for 12 days, so it was, very eye opening, like very eye opening. I mean, we’re talking, there’s people on the unit who are withdrawing from drugs, withdrawing from alcohol, people who have attempted suicide and that’s why they’re in the hospital. So for me, it was just, I don’t want to use the word awkward, but it was just very humbling, I guess, but also kind of awkward because some of the nurses would be like, what are you doing here? Why are you here? And I would tell them like, I have postpartum depression so bad that I literally cannot sleep. I cannot function. I don’t want to put on clothes in the morning. I don’t want to take a shower. I don’t want to eat. Like that’s not normal for me. Like you can tell just from our pre recording conversations, like I’m a very vibrant outspoken person so for me to be quiet, like that’s obvious that something is wrong.

[01:02:19] Kiona: hmm. Yeah. Yeah, and 12 days is a big chunk of time and do you feel like by the time you went home you had a game plan on how you were gonna continue to to navigate that, postpartum depression and anxiety? And I guess I should ask, at what point throughout this 37 days were you officially diagnosed with postpartum depression and anxiety?

[01:02:44] Athena: So the OB diagnosed me with it right away. when I went in for that virtual appointment, they got me in virtually cause that was quicker than going to the office. So she diagnosed me with that right away. And then when I got to the hospital, I want to set the scene here. So my dad drops me off.

I know people there. So they, they, they took me in the back, which I thought was very sweet. I had to still go to the admissions counter and sign the papers and give them my insurance card. And then they took me up the back elevators. To the psychiatry unit and unfortunately, we actually ran into some of my co workers who know me

[01:03:20] Kiona: Mm.

[01:03:21] Athena: And they all said hi like what are you doing here?

and of course, I was in a wheelchair with a bag on my lap and Ironically enough I think it’s you know Looking back maybe a slight blessing in disguise at the hospital. The psychiatry unit is the same floor as L& D So I think they assumed that I like had a complication after the baby and they saw me go up to that floor and I think they just assumed that I went to L& D when in actuality I went the complete opposite way.

So, that was super hard to begin with. And then, I got to the hospital and for those of you, you know, the majority of you who have never stepped foot or know anything about a psychiatry unit. They deal with drugs and alcohol on a daily basis. So the procedure is they take you in a treatment room.

They have you change all your clothes. They give you paper scrubs. They take all your belongings. They take your phone and they put it all in a locked locker in the back of the hospital that you have no access to and you wear those paper scrubs until your clothes are all washed and dried. Because the thought is if you’ve had drugs in the last, you know, days, hours, months, it could be laced in your clothing.

You could have brought it in, whatever the case may be. So to go into a place that I work and then be stripped of all my belongings and have my phone taken away from me just to have a psychiatrist monitor me for some sleeping pills to me, like. I absolutely became manic. So the nurse did my assessment.

They came in, you know, they weigh you in the scrubs, they do your height, they do all the questions and they’re still confused why I’m there. And they kept talking to me about manic disorder. And I was like, no, no, no, you’re missing the point. Like. I’m manic in this moment because this is so foreign to me that that is how I’m reacting because I’m scared out of my mind.

I am so uncomfortable because everybody I know works at this hospital. I am angry because I’m even in the situation and I’m lost. I’m literally just feeling like a lost puppy So it’s not that I went to the hospital lightly like I went kicking and screaming to be honest so I knew that I needed it in that moment, but I did not, I mean, I did go voluntarily.

I don’t want to say that I didn’t, but it was after a week of arguing with my father and my husband. So it was very hard. So anyways, back to the diagnosis, they did start mentioning this manic disorder, manic disorder, manic. And I said, I am manic in this moment. I am barely hanging on to survive. So, when I did the assessment with the doctor the next day, I told her, I’ve been diagnosed with postpartum depression, I barely want to function, and that’s why I’m here.

So, the postpartum diagnosis came about right in the beginning. And then in the hospital, we talked about the postpartum depression with manic episodes and then, major anxiety disorder. So that’s what we kind of settled on.

[01:06:24] Kiona: Wow. Yeah. That’s a lot. And… Yeah. The, the feeling of vulnerability that you had going into your workplace to be seen, and then also super nice of the people that admitted you to take you the back way and kind of like, help you out in that way. but yeah, goodness. Also, I think it’s awesome that you were, it’s kind of like a pro and con of actually being able to get into your workplace.

You know what I mean? Like to be able to connect with people that you could at least somewhat trust, faces that you’ve somewhat seen, people that you’ve passed. So there’s that double edged sword, or two sides of the coin where you’re like, oh, I’ve seen you, like I’ve said hi to you before, but now you’re here helping me in my lowest of low moments, seeing me in my most vulnerable state.

But also I know I could at least potentially trust you. Like, you’re not a complete stranger, you know, so having to balance that and that mind game of where do you fit here, you know,

 so I hear that, but, let’s go back a little bit before, because I kind of asked you two questions last time, which was, what was the game plan that ended up happening after you were in the hospital?

Because you said that you did feel like you left with a game plan.

[01:07:40] Athena: Yeah. So we kind of started with, um, they put me on some very heavy stabilizers, very heavy. So, they did start me on, lithium, a pretty high dose of lithium and some Lamictal, which is actually a seizure medication, but in smaller doses it has been, proven in research to help with depression.

So they started me on both of those. They had me stay on the Seroquil, but not as high. I want to say it was around 200 milligrams. and then at night, they were giving me something for sleep. And I’m getting my medications confused in my brain, so I don’t want to quote it wrong. But, something for sleep at night.

So I was on four steady medications. So, when I was discharged, that, those are the medications that they wanted me to follow up with. I will agree with you, definite silver lining that it was my workplace because so much good came from it. Now that I’m like looking back, something that I, appreciate to this day was that our hospital chain has a outpatient mental health program.

So it is like a day program. So when you get discharged from the psych unit, you have the option to go into this day program and it is from 9 a. m. to 3 p. m., Monday to Friday. And it is group therapy and individual therapy. And there’s a break for lunch where you can stay and eat with your fellow, Patients or if you want to leave for lunch, you have an hour break, you can always come back.

So that to me was the best thing to come out of there because I knew I was not going back to work. I mean, I was slightly functioning for me. I’m getting a couple hours of sleep at night, not as anxious that I could actually, sit down and actually eat something without feeling sick. not anxious, about what’s the next day going to hold? Am I going to sleep tonight? Like those thoughts were still there, but they weren’t as cloudy over my judgment, I guess you could say so. I entered that day program. I did it for seven weeks. at first I would like go for a walk at lunch and try to like distance myself from those patients.

But then slowly, but surely, the end of my first week there, a man who was in the hospital with me, actually joined the day program that Thursday of my first week. So we got to stay together for about three weeks, three weeks. And then a girl that I met in the hospital came to the program our fourth week.

So she joined us. So it was actually really cool to see people outside of the hospital, like reintegrating into their lives. And just trying to get as much help as we possibly could, because I think when you go into a setting that is that intense and that go, go, go, go, go, go, go, I think that if I were to go straight home and do no intense therapy, I think it would have been a totally different story.

[01:10:31] Kiona: Mm. Yeah, I think it’s awesome that your hospital had that reintegration program set in place, because, yeah, who knows what it’s going to look like on the other side of those hospital doors when you try to go back home. 

[01:10:47] Athena: Right. 

[01:10:47] Kiona: And it’s… In my mind, I don’t know if this is, like, stepping on toes of people in the military or those that have, like, gone to war, but, like, I’m thinking of this as you were at war with yourself.

You were emotionally going through your own kind of war, right? You were in this battle, and people don’t just send the military home, you know? But they usually also have re civilian, or, like, reimplementing into civilian life programs and so for them to also have that in a hospital, coming out of the psychiatric ward, I think is a blessing. Like, that’s amazing. I think that’s super cool.

[01:11:29] Athena: Yeah, for sure. For sure. I think it’s something that like you have to be like open to, but I felt like for me, I felt like I already did the hardest thing, like allowing my dad to help me check into the hospital was like the worst.

So to me, it was kind of just like, okay, this is like my rebuilding phase. So, like, if the worst is behind me, I need to put everything I can into becoming the person I was before, if not a different, better version. And this just felt like the next, realistic step to me.

[01:12:02] Kiona: Mm. I love that. I think that’s great. I really do. 

[01:12:06] Athena: Thanks.

[01:12:07] Kiona: Yeah. . one question that did come up to me as you’re listing like all of these medications is these are pretty hefty drugs. And so how did this impact your breastfeeding journey?

[01:12:18] Athena: So sad. Okay, we have to go back a little bit for that. So around when she was about five months old, so in about November, like Thanksgiving ish, I started to get super stressed cause we were already in physical therapy for the torticollis. I knew if it didn’t improve that it would obviously result in a helmet.

So for me it was kind of like I was already having a lot of anxiety just like in my brain and in my body. And I noticed right before Christmas that my milk started to change. And so I was like, Ooh, my milk is getting like really thin. Like it’s not as thick. It’s not as like that, like white ivory color.

It was starting to get like, kind of like tan and just, it was kind of off. So I called the OB way before I called about the not sleeping. And I just said, my milk starting to change. Like, what should I do? And she said, keep bagging it and date it and just keep tracking it. I said, okay. And then.

When I called her on January 8th, so three days after not sleeping, she told me straight up, she’s like, listen, if we try the Ambien, like you cannot breastfeed, like this has to be the end of the line. So. My milk was already so different by January. It was almost like a light gray that I just didn’t feel comfortable feeding it to her.

So we were at that point already going through our freezer supply. So, the last day that I pumped was that morning. January 8th that morning. So I, I pumped that morning. I called the OB. we had that conversation about the Ambien. She called it in. I picked it up that night and then I was still pumping like here and there to get the milk out, you know, cause you can’t just like stop pumping.

but that was like the last milk that I like pumped and like saved for her cause I just didn’t feel comfortable at all.

[01:14:03] Kiona: Mm. Yeah, yeah, and that, was that a really hard thing for you to come to terms with or was it something that you felt was necessary at that time?

[01:14:14] Athena: Yeah. I mean, I knew it was necessary, like logically, but again, like back to that whole like failure cloud, it was just like one more thing like, Oh, you couldn’t keep breastfeeding and keep that up either. So it was kind of just like, Oh, I failed at that too. So it was, it was a big mind game. That’s for sure.

[01:14:35] Kiona: yeah, yeah, so, thank you so much for sharing this really, really intense postpartum journey because People go through this, and you’re living proof of that, and you are on the other side of it, but in addition to that, I’m sure that there are things that pop up here and there, and you’re just like, ugh, I just need a moment, I need to breathe, I need to take a pause, and, yeah, thank you so much for sharing that, and all of this that you went through is what inspired you to create your blog and podcast. So, at what point, postpartum, did you decide, yes, this is what I’m going to do?

And what inspired you to actually do it? Did you have this aha moment of saying, I need to share this with the world?

[01:15:17] Athena: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. So, backing up just a little bit before I decided to share. So after the hospital, I was on consistently the Lamictal and the Lithium and the Seroquil and the fourth medication that I cannot remember, until about. Fall of 2021. So I began tapering those meds slowly, slowly, slowly, and then came off of them around then. At that point in the fall of 21, I was put on Risalti and back on a low dose of Seroquel for sleep.

So those were the only two meds I was taking. And then in the fall of 2022, I had told the doctor, I said, listen, I’m feeling great. I was on very, very low doses of both. And I just said, I’d really like to start tapering. So January one of 2023, we began the tapering process. And at that time in like the parallel universe with my husband, I kind of started telling him like, I’m ready to share my story.

Like, I don’t know what that looks like, but I’m ready. So, in June, June 13th, 2023, I came off of all my meds. So, I currently take a multivitamin and a biotin and that is it. So I’m very proud and pleased to report that. and around that time I just kept saying to Chris, like, I’m, I’m a natural writer.

I’ve always had a journal my whole life. Like just to journal, you know what I did over the weekend or if we took a really special trip, I’d write down the places we stayed or the restaurants or whatnot, but I’ve always had a journal. So I told him, I was like, I think I’ll start a blog. Like, that’ll be so great.

People can read it, blah, blah, blah. And Mr. Like. Zero technical mind, like obviously we’re both medical. He says, do people still read blogs? And I laughed, I was like, Oh, I guess that’s a good question. I don’t know. I said, maybe not. I said, but everybody does podcasts. And he was kind of half joking and he goes, well, why don’t you do a podcast?

And I was like, ugh, I hate my voice, like, all caps, hate my voice, not a fan, don’t even like listening to my voicemail. So I was like, no, I don’t think that’s it. Well, I thought about it for a little while, a little while, a little while, and then July rolled around and one of the pastors at our church who was really involved with us when I was sick and to this day, he’s just like a great influence in our lives.

He kept saying to me like week after week, like, what are you doing with that story girl? You got to share that story and I was like, okay, we will. So we taught a little bit at our church, in a new parenting class and focused on, postpartum, just kind of what it is, the basics, my story.

And that was great. And I learned a lot. It was a great learning opportunity. And that same pastor, he said, I don’t think that’s it. Like, I think there’s more. And I was like, yeah, I don’t know. So I started praying about it, talking to my husband, just going through things. And. Podcasts just kept coming up, kept coming up.

I asked a couple of my really close girlfriends. I was like, listen, this is going to sound crazy. Like if I start a podcast, will you listen? And of course they’re like my best friends. So they’re like, duh. And I said, fine, fine, fine. Like you all have kids and you’re fine. But like, will people listen? Like the women that need it?

Like, will they listen? And something that my husband and the pastor both said to me that is the reason why Delivered exists was. If there was a source like that, when you were sick, would it have helped you?

[01:18:59] Kiona: mmm

[01:18:59] Athena: And I was like, mm, okay. All right. Because back then I used to say all the time, I wish that there was just a website of support, like a network for women and dah, dah, dah, dah, dah.

And like, what can I do? And some of the research about postpartum until about 2020 was very antiquated. So for me, it would be like, read this article from 1998 and I was like, well, that was 20 years ago. So a lot of things have changed, obviously. So that kind of spawned the “Delivered” idea and I just loved the word delivered because it has so many meanings.

Like not only did the medical providers that I worked with and the Lord deliver me from the postpartum depression, like it all started when I delivered a baby. And if I’m going to help other women, it’s going to start when they deliver their babies. So for me, it was just. So strong. And it just kept occurring.

Like I would hear something and I’d be like delivered. Like I was delivered from that completely. And then, I think about like, man, when I delivered the baby, so that’s kind of how it got started. And then I just decided like finding victory is something that as women, like we don’t give ourselves enough credit for.

And I just think that it is a victory, like it is an utter victory from God and the medical community that I am walking and living and breathing oxygen on this planet because for so long I didn’t want any of that. I was ready to throw in the towel and be done and not cause any more heartache for my husband or my daughter.

So. In a nutshell, that is, the reason why the Delivered podcast exists.

[01:20:49] Kiona: I love it so much and I think that the words of both your pastor and your husband saying wouldn’t you have liked a resource or wouldn’t you have used this kind of resource is so very true. I also love that it’s a very specific niche because the specific population or the specific kinds of people or the specific community that you are reaching out to is one that you are a part of. it’s one that you can relate to and connect with. And I don’t know about you, but the whole foundation of community is connection. So that’s a great foundation to have when creating this platform.

[01:21:30] Athena: Thank you.

[01:21:31] Kiona: Yeah, that’s so awesome. I’m really, I’m gonna put all of your links in the show notes as well, so that everybody that’s listening can reach them and have them at their disposal. but let’s go ahead and round up this interview with just a few closing questions. the first question is, what is one piece of advice that you would give to pregnant people as they prepare for labor, birth, and postpartum? 

[01:21:56] Athena: So I would say, kind of what we talked about earlier, just that pelvic floor, I would say research in your area, the best pelvic floor therapists or practice. And I would also recommend, if you don’t have a doula, I think that they can be very influential and helpful for things that, We don’t normally think of whether it’s positioning or whether it’s, breath work while you’re pushing or whether it’s, you know, postpartum resources.

I think that can be very helpful, especially now that, COVID will forever be around, but it’s not as prominent. So the doulas do have permission in the hospitals now. So that’s something, unfortunately, I wasn’t afforded the luxury to have, which is fine, but I think, the pelvic floor work and the doula can make all the difference.

[01:22:45] Kiona: That’s a really great piece of advice. The next question is, what is one resource that we can share with our listeners on your behalf? 

[01:22:51] Athena: I would probably just say, my website will have a resource section where I will go through and upload, with permission. I do have to get some, copy written permissions, but I have created a three ring binder from my inpatient hospital stay and also from that seven week day program, just of different graphs on how you’re feeling.

there’s a couple of different mental health questionnaires, that the psychiatrist will go through with you. I have a copy of that so people can, look through that and see how severe their symptoms are. So there will be a ton of different resources on the website. I just kind of have to work through the fine tooth combing of the copy written articles and things that I have that I’d like to upload.

[01:23:36] Kiona: Okay, that’s great. Yeah, so we’ll just direct people to your website for that as well to just utilize that resource list once it’s all up and running.

[01:23:44] Athena: Okay.

[01:23:46] Kiona: And my final question to you is, if you could describe your birth and postpartum with one word, what would it be?

[01:23:54] Athena: Unparalleled.

[01:23:56] Kiona: Mmm, I like it. I like it. Explain a little bit more behind that, why you chose that word.

[01:24:03] Athena: So at first, the, the first word that I thought of was like amazing or, like just something that you like cannot compete with because, birth is just so unknown. and there’s just, there’s really nothing like it. You can compare other life experiences and things like that, but I think the act of physically birthing another life successfully, whether that is a VBAC or a vaginal or a cesarean, whatever that looks like for you, is amazing. But I just think the act of that happening is just so powerful, and I don’t think that we give it enough power.

[01:24:43] Kiona: I 100 percent agree. I 100 percent agree. I love it. Thank you. Thank you so much, Athena. I am so, so happy and I’m so honored that you shared your story with me and my listeners today. And I am more than happy to send them all of your info for your podcast and your blog as well. And just to, you know, support each other and then also support the communities that we serve as creators.

So thank

[01:25:10] Athena: Yeah, thank you so much for your time.

[01:25:12] Kiona: Yeah, of course.

[01:25:22] Kiona: Interviewing Athena for this episode on her birth of Cecelia and her postpartum experience was truly amazing. She had such a positive vibe coming from her throughout the entire interview. And I am so honored that she was so vulnerable to share her entire story with us. Athena. Thank you so much for telling us your story. 

And like I said, in the episode, you are a bad-ass and you are doing amazing, And I’m so excited to see where your podcast delivered, finding victory after postpartum depression goes. And I look forward to listening to some of those episodes as well. 

Next week. I am super excited to be sharing another story with you. You will be hearing three very different birth experiences from Whitney Hardie. During her first pregnancy and birth she had an unmedicated birth in the hospital and had to advocate really strongly to make that happen. She also experienced some obstetric violence and didn’t really get to process it until after the fact. For her second birth, she had a dreamy home birth and her third birth was precipitous, which means. Very very fast. Usually under three hours of labor. So tune in next week to hear all of the juicy details that Whitney has to share. 

And if you’re still here, don’t forget to leave a review or to find me on Instagram, @birthasweknowitpodcast. I would love to hear from you and learn how the podcast plays a role in your life. 

All right, bye for now. 

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