76-Jeanelle Harvey-Bridges-Miscarriage-2 Unassisted Vaginal Free Births-The Intuitive Parent

Description:

Even though Jeanelle worked in healthcare as a registered nurse, she still decided that giving birth in the healthcare system was not the safest option for her or her babies. After getting diagnosed with PCOS at 16 and then gestational diabetes during her pregnancy she was put in the high-risk category for pregnancy and birth. Because of this she decided to dive deep into her own research and choose her own path to birth and had both of her children at home unassisted.

birthasweknowitpodcast.com/76

Disclaimer: This podcast is intended for educational purposes only with no intention of giving or replacing any medical advice. I, Kiona Nessenbaum, am not a licensed medical professional. All advice that is given on the podcast is from the personal experience of the storytellers. All medical or health-related questions should be directed to your licensed provider.

Want to hear another story about freebirth in Australia? Chec out Episode Ep. 42-Ashley Winning-3 Births-Cesarean & Vaginal-Rosie,Annie & Millie

Resources:

The Intuitive Parent-Jeanelle Harvey-Bridges: https://www.theintuitiveparent.com.au/
The Intuitive Parent Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/share/1BFyA6crVb/

Definitions:

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Transcription of Episode 76:

Intro 0:08
Welcome to Birth As We Know It, a podcast that is dedicated to recognizing the many different ways that birth unfolds. I am your host, Kiona Nessenbaum. I have experienced birth as a doula, a student midwife, a birth assistant, and as a mother of three amazing children of my own. After attending over 140 births, I’ve realized that each birth experience is truly unique. So make sure you subscribe and join me as we are guided through many different birth experiences through the lens of the storyteller. Please be aware that some of these stories can be triggering to hear. So feel free to pause, take a breath, and come back and listen whenever you’re ready. With that said, let’s prep ourselves to dive deep and get detailed about what really happens in the birth state.

Disclaimer 1:06
As a reminder, this podcast is intended for educational purposes only and has no intention of giving or replacing any medical advice. All advice that is given on the podcast is from the personal experiences of the storytellers. All medical or health related questions should be directed to your license provider.

Kiona 1:26
Before we dive into this episode today, I want to give a huge shout out to all of the birth as we know it podcast listeners that are part of the Facebook group. And the reason why I want to give you a shout out is simply because I love and appreciate you. I really love our engagement that we have on our Friday questions because we get to discuss things that we have similar responses to, as well as things that we have different responses to. And if you listening now want to be part of the engagement, you can go to a birth as we know it podcast dot com forward slash community we would love to have you there and have you part of the crew. Now, when it comes to today’s episode, we are speaking with Jeanelle and Jeanelle is sharing her two unassisted home birth experiences in Australia. And we also hear from her partner just a little bit, but it’s great to hear his voice and get his opinion as well. And if you like this episode, I highly suggest that that after you’re done, tune into episode 42 with Ashley winning, where she shares her birth experience of an unassisted home birth in Australia as well. Now, the thing that makes Ashley Story different is she actually has an unassisted home birth after already having had two caesareans. So her story is quite different. But all right, let’s go ahead and dive into today’s episode with Jeanelle. Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Earth as we Know It podcast. Today I will be interviewing Jeanelle Harvey- Bridges, who is the owner of the Intuitive Parent, which is dedicated to supporting moms in their early parenthood. So, Jeanelle, welcome and thank you. You’re going to be sharing your two birth stories with us today.

Jeanelle 3:11
Hey, kiddo. Thank you so much for having me. It’s. It’s. I love to remember. I’m so excited for this.

Kiona 3:17
I am so ready to dive into this with you, because when I was reading your guest’s request form, there’s just so much goodness in that brief description that you gave me, and I want to hear all the details. So what we’re going to do is we’re just going to start off with conception of baby number one. So baby number one, were you surprised? All the things.

Jeanelle 3:36
Yeah. So my firstborn, he’s now two. He was. He was very much planned. I’ve got a history of polycystic ovarian syndrome. So PCOS and I was told that I wouldn’t be able to fall pregnant. Naturally, Ava might not even be able to have kids because, you know, cycles were regular hormones. All over the place, you name it. So my conception journey started at 16 just because I was like, I’ve always known I wanted to be a mum. So when my husband and I were finally ready, obviously I wasn’t ready at 16, but when I was finally ready to start having kids about two or three years ago, we did all the things, got all the blood tests, made sure that we were on track, and I’m a registered nurse, so I wanted to do everything by the book so that I was going through the ovulation induction route with him and being told that we can go ovulation induction. Unlikely to work, but we’ll try it anyway and thank God that we actually were successful first go. And that was kind of the start of things. I had had a miscarriage, an unplanned miscarriage about six months before I fell pregnant with him, and that was a big surprise because I actually didn’t know I was pregnant until I was having that miscarriage, you know? So I was just like, Oh man, this is the beginning of my infertility. Thank goodness it wasn’t so. So yeah, so that was that was the conception of him. And that led me on to on a very interesting journey, starting very, very clinical and very, very clinical.

Kiona 5:00
Yeah, that’s the part I’m excited to hear about because as a registered nurse, you just said you like going by the book. So what were the steps that you took in order to make sure that your pregnancy went well?

Jeanelle 5:13
So again, doing everything by the book, I wanted to go to the birth center in our local hospital here, which is midwife led because growing up I see myself as one of the lucky ones in terms of the example that I was set in my household around the attitude towards birth. I know a lot of women and a lot of my girlfriends grew up with a mum or an aunty or someone who basically scarred them and put major, major fire blocks in their minds. Having told their traumatic birth stories, but my mom, having had a very intervention led birth like inductions, episiotomy, as you name it. She always talked really positively about her birth and how amazing it is to give birth. And I was actually at my sister’s birth I was seven, so had a very, very positive experience of birth. And I wanted to create that for myself, having heard all the trauma that was around birth. And so that’s why I was like, Right, I need to go to the birthing centre. I need to have a very natural birth, Like, that’s what I want. I don’t need to, but that’s what I want. And so, yes, I applied for that. Now here in Australia we have a lot of red tape when it comes to a natural physiological birth. Why? I do not know, and I don’t know if I’ll ever find out, but I had to go because of my history of PCOS. I had to have a lot of testing at 16 weeks, including their gestational diabetes test. If you’ve had that test, it’s an awful test. Disgusting, sugary drink you have to drink and then they test your blood sugar. It’s basically like a stress test for your body and putting a woman’s body under stress like that is I don’t know why we do it. I don’t know. It’s just one of those things, again, not something that I’m here to solve, but I lo and behold, I failed the stress test by point one minimal. I’m not sure there’s a different measurement you use in America, I’m fairly sure, but I’m not sure how that translates. But it’s literally point one of a million mile per litre that I failed my fasting blood sugar test with, and then that immediately disqualified me from the birthing centre because now I was a high risk pregnancy. So at 16 weeks, before the placenta was established and their whole argument is that gestational diabetes is caused by the placenta causing insulin resistance. So anyway, so it’s, it’s ridiculous anyway, so that when I signed it, I was disqualified from the birthing centre. I went down into a spiral of grief. I was then told that. Right. So you’ve got gestational diabetes, by the way, you’ve got a week to get your blood sugars under control with diet and exercise, otherwise you’re ending on insulin. So I was like, okay, well, two weeks on a long time. So of course I that on insulin that meant that my diagnosis meant that I had to go in for monthly ultrasounds. I had to go in for monthly endocrinologist appointments. And I was also told that my baby is likely to be big. I have to be induced at 38 weeks and I will probably end up in a C-section. And if I don’t follow these rules, there’s a good chance my baby will die.

Being told that again, not even halfway through your pregnancy, I was livid is probably an understatement.

You know, I was I was so shocked and so angry, so frustrated at everything that I hated my pregnancy from that point forward. Up until that point, I was excited. I was like, obviously that my dream of becoming a mom was coming true and then being told all these things. I was like grieving the birth that I had envisioned for as long as I could remember. And so this is where my journey of going from, wanting to do everything by the book to Now I’m a Rebel

started. Yeah.

Kiona 9:11
Yes. Okay. So just a clarifying question. So you are saying that because you have a history of PCOS, your provider suggests that you get your glucose tolerance test at 16 weeks?

Jeanelle 9:28
Yes.

Yes. Yes. So that’s one of the criteria in the birthing centers here, is that you basically have to have the perfect pregnancy to end up in the birthing center. Otherwise, you are disqualified because the midwives allegedly are not equipped to manage that high risk pregnancy.

Kiona 9:50
Yeah. That gives me all kinds of feelings.

Jeanelle 9:53
Yep. Not surprised.

Kiona 9:57
Here as a birth worker, former student midwife, I was an out of hospital birth midwife, so I was not practising as a certified nurse midwife, but in an out of hospital setting we have that requirement as well, right you have to meet a certain requirement to be considered safe to birth in an out of hospital setting. Now we also use the glucose tolerance test as a deterring factor, but it wasn’t done at 16 weeks. 16 weeks is ten weeks prior to the earliest time you should be taking it.

Jeanelle 10:30
Yep.

Kiona 10:31
And if someone does cross that threshold of saying that they are officially diagnosed with gestational diabetes, the midwives that I have worked with and I would like to say that I am extremely lucky because not all midwives are like this. Then midwives that I worked with would allow that client to stay in care if they could control their blood sugars with diet and exercise. The only time that they officially risked Medicare was when they did need to do insulin, But there were still options to be cared for prenatally by your midwife and then transfer to a hospital setting to have continuity of care. That’s interesting to me, and I am so intrigued because. You know, there are so many similarities, yet differences between Australia and the U.S..

Jeanelle 11:22
Yeah. Yeah. So look at when it comes to the DTT here is we usually test at 28 weeks. That is the standard. And I think that’s a close to an international standard actually. But yeah, so because of that PCOS label, I got the you need to do DTT and now I’ve got a label. So. So yeah it is it’s ridiculous. And when I started my my grief process is what I call it, I was craving that birth. I went into a really dark place where I was like, Well, maybe I just shouldn’t have a baby. You know, I was just, you know, I was just not. Not a good time. It was really, really. Intense grief because I was like, I don’t want blades near me. I don’t want them near me. I mean, obviously some women do have C-sections, They do have episiotomy and sometimes it’s genuinely needed. I am never going to say But the medical profession is the big bad wolf, and you should never, ever go see it. But the more that because I’m a researcher, right, not just a medical professional, I need to know how to look for evidence. But as a person non non nurse, I’m also a lot I love research. I love getting that evidence. So that took me on a journey of evidence seeking of how am I going to manage my gestational diabetes so that I can have the birth that I want. And that led me down to discover that within the last five years at the time. So within the last seven, 7 to 8 years, we have had some major changes in the thresholds of what is considered a diabetic in pregnancy versus not. So it got changed from there. And again, I’m so sorry, I don’t know that conversion into the units you use to measure blood sugar, but in Australia the threshold used to be 5.5 minimal for fasting. And then there’s a couple other thresholds for when you’re no longer fasting as part of the test. And then the last eight years it was reduced down to

5505511 is the fasting And mine of course was 5.2.

So, yeah, I mean, it’s just interesting because what I found alongside that little nugget was that since they change the threshold, they’ve had a 75% increase in of pregnant women. So is it real? I don’t know. Is it not real? Don’t know. I didn’t do the research myself, but the numbers to me spoke to itself and I was like, This is ridiculous.

Kiona 13:54
And that led you down the path of making. Really big decision.

Jeanelle 13:58
It really did. It really did. So once I had grieved, once I had found out, okay, look, this is ridiculous. I’m now on insulin. being told that I’m have to be induced. I’m having to go for these growth scans. And every time I go in there, like, oh, he’s a big boy.

Oh, yeah, yeah. I turned to my husband and I asked, Hey, how about we reconsider homebirth? And when I say reconsider is when I first fell pregnant, I was like, I asked him, How about we do a home with like, a home would be amazing, because I absolutely not. This is our first Neither of us know what on earth we’re doing. No. And I was like, okay, I’ll go to the birth center. Obviously got disqualified from the birth center. And I was like, let’s let’s let’s think about home birth again. And he he doesn’t identify with this. But I like to think that as a result of him seeing me grieve my birth, that I thought I would have I think his heart was a bit softened. And so he was like, fine, you know, do some research, see if you can find a midwife who would take you on. And I would go from there. And at this point I was about 20 to 24 weeks pregnant. And so obviously not obviously, but unfortunately most of the midwives who would take on a high risk, quote unquote, high risk pregnancy were either fully booked or way out of our price range. And obviously those who were available just wouldn’t take me on because I have this 0ddd on insulin rival. And I was like, Well, there’s this thing called free birth. But I came across and I was like, This is bizarre. People birth without any help and it’s normal. Like what? And so, again, being a researcher, I looked into it like I went deep and I was watching birth videos and like free birth videos, and I was learning physiological birth and what that actually looked like. And, you weight coach pushing isn’t the thing. And wait, like, you know, you don’t have to have all these things and it was this is this whole new world opened up for me because again, my mom never talked about physiological birth because she had inductions and she had a be because even though it was positive for her, I didn’t know that that was possible to not have at least a little bit of intervention that birth is inherently dangerous is what the thought that I had. Like the you know, there’s always a level of danger to it. And so when I found out the free birth was a thing of was is this is pretty cool. This is like my sliver of hope. Like I could have the birth that I that I’ve dreamed of. So I presented it to my husband and I was like, Look, I’ve done my research. These are the really red flags. These are the genuine reasons that we would need a hospital or medical professional for. And here are the like the how this is, how often it happens and this is how you would manage it. And I actually created a whole folder of like A to Z of the dream from my birth and my labor and the process of birth and labor. But in case he needed anything, he would be able to refer to that. And he turned to me and said, okay, I trust you.

Kiona 17:20
Hmm.

Jeanelle 17:21
And that was a big thing. And it’s been a big thing since because I’ve now had my second baby about eight weeks ago. And trust from your birth support, in my case, that was my husband was was hit. just a major mindset shift of someone trusts me to know what’s good for my body. After being told for the 20 to 24 weeks how broken my body is and how in capabilities of looking after the life that it’s wearing inside, you know the doubt that that place and then it just kind of washed away in many ways when I was told, hey, I trust I trust you. So. So yeah, that set me on right before free breathing. Okay, let’s do this. And again, my my nursing side still wanted to keep the rules in some way, I guess. So I still waiting for my appointments. I still got know, ultrasounds. I basically led to the hospital to believe that I would be birthing with them. So when 38 weeks rolled, I rolled around. They were like, Right, so we’re booking you in for your induction. And I declined. And they then listed all of the risks of declining, and I had to go on an alternative care plan and again, threatened dead babies and all these things and I’ll never forget this one. Obi quoted a study saying, if you decline induction and you go past 38 or 40 weeks, your risk of stillbirth doubles as a gestational diabetic. I had read that study and I said, Oh, you’re talking about the study where the risk doubles from 0.01%, right? Yep.

So as I it’s okay. I read that study. I mean, I’m happy with those statistics. I’m happy to take that risk. And they were shocked that I had firstly read that study and also that I would be willing to take that risk, that that’s really dangerous of me. They’re like, you’re a nurse. You should know that the statistics are significant. And I was like, I agree, they are significant, but I feel safer not going down the induction pathway. Like, for me, it was a big thing that I did not want a cascade of interventions. I did not want it. Most of us, when we find out we’ve got something or something’s happening in our life, we will seek out a community on social media. And so I was part of many groups of just good mums and people would share the birth stories and it was traumatic after traumatic with the occasional positive one, and I just didn’t want that. So yeah, my alternative care plan essentially meant that I had to go for second daily. So every second day I had to go for a CT scan to make sure the baby wasn’t in distress, which the midwives almost every time they were surprised that my I passed my CTG within 1020 minutes of being there. They’re like, Oh, that was quick. My baby’s grooming so well. And I was like, Yes, I know.

Oh yeah.

And so obviously when 40 weeks rolled around, I was 30, I was 39 and six, and I was on my second daily day at the hospital and I lost my mucus plug there and I told them that and they were like, All right, so we’re admitting you. You’re going into labour. You know, we should augment it. And I was like, No, no, I’m going home. I had to again, listen to their threats of the status of my baby’s health and that you know, obviously like it’s a bit of a wearing down scenario where when they had left the room, I turned to my husband. I was in tears and I was like, am I being selfish? Am I being selfish for wanting this birth to go smoothly, to not go into surgery, to not have synthetic oxytocin? But I wasn’t all that I didn’t want it. Am I being selfish? Because this is what the what and I forgot to mention this is when I was when I first was diagnosed and fine with finding out that all the things that GD meant, I was like, Oh, no. Like I’m putting my own child at risk of high risk of obesity and heart disease and this and that. And so it was just as major thing that I was like, I’m negatively impacting unborn child. And the pressure and guilt that came with that was was huge. And he said, Well, you did your research and, you know, you feel fine, you know? Right. And I was like, Yeah. And he’s like, Well, then we’ll stick with your plan. And if you decide you want to change your plan, then you change your plan. And it was just again, that level of trust was just like, Oh, okay, yeah. Like, you know, we can always change the plan. Like, that’s okay.

Kiona 21:54
And here is Chanel’s partner, Jackson.

Jackson 21:58
I was against it at first. I didn’t really know anything about it. the show explained it, and I trust her. So yeah, I just kind of gradually kind of came around to it and added trust in her. had a whole booklet for me of things I could do if things go wrong. What we do there. I knew most of it and we discussed it, but I was just there as handy to have.

Jeanelle 22:21
You know, we did our research. We know we know what we need to do if something should, for some reason go wrong, because we we’re not planning for it, but sometimes it just happens that way. And so we went home. And so I lost my biggest 1 p.m. and came home around three, 330. I had my first little niggle and I was like, Whoa, that’s not a Braxton Hicks. That’s not a vacciniques. That’s something more. So we went for a walk and came back and did my curb walking. I was like, you know, let’s get this going. And by 5:00 I was an established laborer and I had set up my dining room and moved the table and chairs away. And I had my birthday all set up the few weeks leading up to the point, and we’d had, little fairy lights. I did use attendance machine as soon as my contractions were kind of regular, I was like, right. Like, I’ll chalk that on and just labor. It was just I had a birthday like that. My so I did have a I did, I did have a Dula who was her main role was to just maintain the birth space. So like birth or water would be, you know, good temperature if we needed any extra towels or like just like an extra helping hand. L’m emotional support for my husband more than anything else, I essentially told them, just let me be, just would just witness me basically. And so that’s exactly what they did as I was laboring for a good, I don’t know, three or 4 hours in my living room. And then I moved to the shower and the shower was amazing. I love laboring in the shower. was in there for a good three or 4 hours. And now we were in at the time we had moved in how pregnant was? I was maybe four months, five months pregnant when we moved into our now And so it was a very and we had built it. So it’s very So we had new grass out the to establish that we were watering that I was in the shower for 3 to 4 and then later on went into the birth pool. So you can imagine our water bill that that that quarter we actually had the department send an extra letter to just check for leaks because we used a lot of water. But anyway, so I was laboring in the shower for a couple of hours and as I got out of the shower, I was overwhelmed by the sensations in many ways. But at the same time I was like actually very, very calm in that I knew what was happening because I had really, really researched it and I researched it. That’s a very like cold like I really immerse myself in what does it look like, what is happening in my body, and like, what are the thoughts might be having? And so I was I think I was really well prepared for a first time labouring person. Yeah. So when I got out of the shower, I asked my for a cloth wipe my face and he goes, he goes, goggles off, goes and gets it. And as he comes into the room, he wants to help. And then he dabs me on my face. And that’s just when a contraction started. I’m like, Get off!

he’s just sorry. And afterwards, like, after the contraction is I’m so sorry. Come here. I want the cloth. And so I grabbed the cloth back and it was just one of those things that, I just didn’t want to be touched. Like, I was quite funny because it seems to be a bit of a trend in both my labor so far as soon as I get into established labor, I start stripping the layers off of my body I’ll quickly lose my shirt, I’ll quickly lose my pants, and then eventually I’ll lose everything. And it’s just I’m just this naked, pregnant, wild woman just pacing around. And so, you know, it was just it was kind of funny in that sense. And then we still laugh about that. It’s just me telling him off for wanting to help me, but then being apologetic immediately after. And it’s just one of those things of it’s quite crazy how your mind just needs to focus on that one thing right then and then. It’s just, yeah, it’s really cool and at that point I moved to the bath pool, so this was about just before 11 p.m.. So I’d been laboring for what, 6 hours or so. I don’t remember much in the birth bill because I had just before I got in the bath bill, I had gone through transition where I had two very, very big vomits like I had copious amounts of liquid coming from my body. And at the time I was like, This is a lot, but this is normal, you know, like I was just able to, like, reassure myself that it’s normal. What’s happening is, okay, it’s normal. got into the birth pool and I and I actually I was in such a trance at that point where I was just in and out of, restful, periods I was like, sleepy. And then a contraction would come on and I would, you know, be woken up by it. And yeah, it got to the point where I was starting to push. And I again, I told them I don’t want pushing help, like I just don’t want it. So just breathe with me. So we actually before I went into labor, we had this little exercise where we tested what is my coping mechanism? So we had like this ice test where we we put I put an ice block in my hands and we would like, okay, like, what is your reaction to this discomfort? And for a good minute or so and very quickly, we realized that my coping mechanisms were I would either talk, be like, Oh, it is so cold. Like, oh my goodness, like, or I would just be breathing. And so we were like, okay, which one is a bit more resourceful for labor? And so like breathing. So you need to make sure that you’re breathing. So I very much focus on my breathing during both my labors is like open jaw, like this is the saying open jaw, open, funny, like, you know.

It’s like this. You know, some people have these beautiful birth affirmations minus that.

And so, you know, I’m very just aware that, you know, relaxer George and all, you got to do it. Make sure you’re breathing. Keep your breathing low like, oh. And so again, we kind of agreed beforehand that if my breathing goes a bit higher pitched and, you know, a bit more tense, that they would come in with lower breathing sounds. And so that really, really helped when I was overwhelmed by pushing because obviously that pressure in your if you haven’t felt it before, can be quite overwhelming as a very unfamiliar sensation. So there was a couple of times where they would come in and just help with the hose and I would go back and I could just tone match them. And it was big for me. Like it was just like I’m supported, I’m here, I’m safe, everything’s good. And so, yeah. So I started pushing. I think about an hour and a bit before he was born. So just before 1 a.m., it was quite cool because I’ve got a birth video of this online. I took on my phone and you can see where like the traction just before I had my first push sensation was just like a contraction. It’s like, you’re breathing through it. It’s it’s painful. But, you know, you can tell that it’s, you know, that’s happening. The next one you can hear in my body, in my voice how I just could not stop myself from pushing it like that. I have I’m going to try and imitate it. it’s essentially just I was breathing, breathing, breathing. And then next minute there was this major, major urge to push. And I just could not help but go into that. And I knew of like, okay, my baby’s coming. And then after he’d crowned. I actually, you know, I was like, prepared for the the Ring of Fire. And I was like, Yeah, okay, there it is. for him, it was over very, very quickly. And I was just like, I don’t know if it was because I was in the birth pool or if it was because I was prepared for it, but I wasn’t too fazed by it. But I was fazed by so I was so surprised is after he had crowned, you know, he was just kind of there for a good minute or so between contractions. And then I had my my Dula had a GoPro underwater, so I’ve got it again, a video of him having and and then the next contraction, it was just so amazing is he turned as babies do is just they’re so involved their own birth it’s just blows my mind babies are so smart. Anyway he turned and fetal injection just kicked in and he came flying out with the next last little push and that turning and pushing shock to me I have I went from her like to like shrill shrieking of like, what the hell just came out of me. And interestingly, I should just go back is just before he crowned, I felt a pop and that’s when my waters broke. So my waters didn’t break until the very last minute. So maybe one or two pushes before he was born. And I when I when he came flying out, I obviously grabbed him out of the water. And I just remember saying, My child, my child. It was so, so emotional and. And yeah, he was perfect. Manuel, my little baby. He was perfect. Like, he was just. so peaceful. He did come out and, you know, he shared his voice briefly. But then after that, he was so calm just kind of like looking at me, looking at the environment. So he was born just after two.

Kiona 31:09
All right, you guys, I am hopping on here to say very quickly that Chanel has given us the opportunity to actually listen to the audio of her birth Oh, so you are about to dive in to the throes of labor with for 3 minutes. And it is the moment which she pushed out her son. And as she mentioned, there was a GoPro. So you will hear a slight change in audio, but it’ll pop right back and you will be able to all of the emotions that she’s talking As she cheers herself on, you will hear her speak Afrikaans to herself and her son. She says, almost there. Almost there. And after her son is born, she says, My child. My child. And in the end, you hear her You are so beautiful. Over and over. So let’s dive into labor with Jeanelle.

Birth Video Audio 32:04
Ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow!

Wow!

Ow, ow,

ow, ow, ow,

ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow,

ow, ow, ow! Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. You know. Ow, ow, ow, ow, ow,

ow, ow, ow, ow,

ow!

Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Whoa,

oh,

oh!

Ow!

Oh,

oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, my. Ow, ow, ow, Ow! Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello. How. Oh, ow, ow, ow, ow,

ow,

ow!

Oh,

my God! Oh, my God! Oh,

look, I know.

Oh!

Ow!

Ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow,

ow, ow, ow, ow! Oh, oh, oh, oh!

Ow, ow!

Oh! Parents. Oh,

yes.

Hi.

Kiona 35:03
As you can hear, that is an extremely emotional moment for Chanel and her family. Chanel, thank you so much for sharing that with us. Now, let’s go ahead and dive back into the rest of this story.

Jeanelle 35:17
So I had a nine hour labor and that’s quite literally half of the expected labor here in our hospitals is for first time, the average labor is about 18 hours. And so it was great. And, you know, it was everything that I had hoped for. Right. And then what happened next was really frustrating, because what happened was I was convinced then by a midwife to go into hospital a few hours later, even though everything was fine and placenta came within 45 minutes. It was essentially a textbook, undisturbed birth and labor. And, you know, we were I knew I had a bit of tearing because it was quite painful and I had paid, but I had it in my mind to make for me. The way I prepared for that was I knew that there’s a chance out here because that is how they work sometimes. But in my mind I was like, Right. So second, I would not seek medical attention for it. So to fourth said, I might consider it force. Obviously, I feel like I would need some assistance that, but then I knew that the odds of that happening with undisturbed birth and labour is quite unlikely. So again, a risk that I was willing to take. So yeah, anyway, we went to slave and you know how cuddles and sort of breastfeeding and all these things. And I then got a call from the hospital at a, I think it was like 8 a.m. that same day, so 6 hours postpartum and they’re like, Oh, so you’re 40 weeks

We’ve got an earlier appointment for your CTG because then I had to go on Daly City days and I was like, Oh, I don’t need to. It’s okay. Baby was born and

this is the best conversation I’ve had in my life is the minute the midwife goes, Oh, oh, okay, Where did you have the baby? And I’ll sit at home. Oh, okay. And who attended it on, you know, just me and my husband. And she’s like, Oh, okay. And you’re okay? Like, is everyone alright? And I was like, Yeah, we’re fine. Then she’s like, Well, look, I’m just let you just, you know, call my, call my, my mess, my mess manager and then we’ll just, you know, I’ll, I’ll, I’ll call you. But I was like, Sure.

It was so funny. calls me back again in hysterics. And convinces me that I need to go into hospital because of my gestational diabetes. Baby might be hypoglycemic, so low blood sugar. And obviously for me, I was like, Fair enough. I did research this that this is a possibility. However, I was like, I feel baby is fine, I’ll do the quote unquote right thing and go in and have him checked out. Worst decision I made because I had to then burst my postpartum bubble. We went down to the hospital and they proceeded to come up with excuses to keep us there for 12 hours before I decided to discharge against medical advice. They were doing serial blood sugar tests on him every time he would pass. And they were like, Yeah, but he’s still on the lower end. And I was like, Yeah, but it’s fine. Like, he’s still breastfeeding and I feel fine. And they also, while I was there, convince me to get my perineum checked out. Of course, I discovered I had a second degree and they were listing the reasons why I should get sutures. And I actually stopped the procedure halfway through. I was like, You guys need to stop. too painful. Just your. I feel like you’re tearing me in half. And they were like, Oh, yeah, but there is a tear there. And, you know, you’ve got to make sure that it’s suture. And I was like, Well, no. So then they got the the O.B. to come and convince me to get sutures. And I she was listing down the risks of not getting sutures and less listless tends to my husband says it can also impact your sexual function. Turns back to me and continues listing her three.

Kiona 39:02
Oh, God.

Jeanelle 39:04
I know. And I mean, I don’t think it impacted my sexual function, seeing as I’ve since had another baby. But

but, you know, that’s just me.

Kiona 39:16
Right. Right.

Jeanelle 39:17
Oh, goodness. eventually, like I say, I just tried to get some medical advice because they were like, all you need to keep you overnight for this. And that reason. I was like, Well, no, we’re fine. We’re going home. And that was the end of that. But it sent me on a little bit of an interesting journey of why I started kind of advocating for evidence informed by individual tailored practice. And yeah, so it was really interesting. I feel like I’ve told forever and ever so.

Kiona 39:40
That’s great. I love it. I love how smooth your story just came out like that because you are hanging on to so many details that are so important. And that fact right there where we’re going to be best friends.

It’s like the kind of birth talk that I love everything that you’re hanging on to and doing your research and talking about. The comparisons of like how your providers are talking to you

Jeanelle 40:07
Mm

Kiona 40:07
and all of that is so important and you are extremely well informed

Jeanelle 40:11
hmm.

Kiona 40:12
with being a registered nurse. And then also just having the desire to do research on your own to come up with these answers to your questions and then to tell the provider face to face. Yeah, I know exactly what you’re talking about. Yeah, absolutely. So that is amazing. And I love all of that for you. I loved how it all played out for you because there was a happy ending. Right. And of course, there is risk to this, right? With free birth. There is risk. But from the sounds of it, you did your due diligence and making sure that you had a backup plan. You continued to go to care. You found your sweet spot and you followed through.

Jeanelle 40:55
Yeah.

Kiona 40:55
And I think that’s great.

Jeanelle 40:56
Thank you. No, I totally agree. And this is often what I tell some of my my mum friends, because then they’re like, Oh, I could never do that. And I was like, I don’t think everyone should free birth. And it’s not as I like, you know, looking down at anyone else who has a different experience, sort of. I don’t think everyone should. I think that when you decide to freebies, you take 100% responsibility for what happens. And some people don’t want to take that. And that’s okay. For me, I was like, Absolutely, I want it. They call me a control freak, but I also absolutely like give that responsibility to me. And agree. Yes, you do. I always say if you decide to free birth, it shouldn’t be from a place of fear. It should be from a place of informed empowerment. Like, you know, you can’t just go into it being like, just cause it’s a very natural process and our bodies were absolutely made for it. And I strongly if most of our bodies won’t create a baby that’s too big to birth. But again, there are some things like they were a couple of things that we did I made sure that I looked at and there’s obviously not medical advice at all, but these are the things that that I looked out for. These were my red flags that I would trans before. And it was a prolapsed cord. It was a trans presentation. So hand first it was copious amounts of bleeding to the point where I would feel unwell. My intuition was one of the criteria for transfer is if my intuition said something’s wrong, what was the other one? If I was fatigued, if I just couldn’t do it anymore. And the very last one. Sorry, I said last one before, but the last one was like foul smelling blood or mucus or anything like that. So for me, I was like, okay, if this are meconium, that’s okay. If baby’s coming, if baby’s not coming, then that’s probably a reason to transfer as well. I had a whole things that we would look out for. But other than that, I was happy that everything else would be variation of normal and we would take it as it comes. So that was my birth story with my first, and it was really, really cool. I was like, I think very, very happy with it. Again, I the buy the book thing and went to the child health nurses and all of the postpartum checks and all that. But few weeks into my breastfeeding journey I was like, something is amiss. he’s breastfeeding. Fine. He’s gaining weight. but there’s something like something is missing. there’s something not quite right. Like my breastfeeding sessions are going for like 30, 40 minutes. Is this normal? And it wasn’t cluster to feeding. I was like, this doesn’t quite like. I was again very fortunate that I knew where to go, look for information on how to breastfeed because I’m again of the belief that breastfeeding is a very natural thing. But it doesn’t mean that we all know how to breastfeed. Breastfeeding is a skill that you have to many women feel discouraged because they’re like, Oh, my body can’t breastfeed. It’s just, No, no, you just haven’t learned the skill of breastfeeding Breastfeeding is hard. It’s very natural, but it’s very hard. So that’s something we can go into in a little bit. But I kept asking these providers, I was like, Something’s wrong. And they’re like, No, something’s not wrong is gaining weight. There’s no nipple damage, Like it’s fine. And again, my intuition was like, Nah, there’s something. I eventually at eight weeks old so two months I finally had a provider that was like, okay, fine, we’ll just do it. We’ll check his mouth. We could not lift his lip, his frontal upper lip. So he had a very, very big lip tie. So once I had that revised, I’m not going to lie. I don’t remember there being any major changes to his breastfeeding in terms of, you know, some people are like, oh, I had the baby’s lip or tongue tie release and I had a new It wasn’t quite the case for us. But I do remember the breastfeeding sessions went much shorter. And so I was again very fortunate that I have a very, very strong let down to the point where baby goes, mom pop up, you know.

So I think in many ways that kind of helped him thrive despite the fact that he had that tie. So, I mean, looking back, I don’t I don’t think that it was the thing that changed everything, but it was just kind of that whole process that I went through of being told, no, he’s fine, he’s fine. There’s nothing wrong. And I kept thinking there is something. And finally being recognized and being acknowledged for, Hey, you’re not just a crazy postpartum lady.

So that kind of set me on the journey of of starting my own practice I want moms to be heard and listened And when their intuition is saying that there’s something that let’s do some investigating together, like let’s do it not just being oh, you know, you fit the box of the hundreds of women that I’ve talked to and you’re fine kind of thing. And that’s just that’s not what I’m about.

Kiona 45:40
No, I think that’s great. And I will also say I think that is true for many people that decide to open up their own practice. They have an experience that they have personally been through or someone close to them has been through. And it really shifts their mindset on, wow, there’s not many resources for this.

Jeanelle 45:58
Nine.

Kiona 45:59
Like the fact that we don’t have anywhere close to enough research on what happens to the biological female body throughout pregnancy. Like, we have ideas, but we need more research on what’s going on because there’s so much that’s changing literally in our biology, in our brain, in our body. We are never the same.

Jeanelle 46:22
No.

Kiona 46:23
it is so intriguing to me. How deep you can truly go with this kind of stuff.

Jeanelle 46:29
Hmm.

Kiona 46:29
So I really love that you opened up your own practice and getting the resources that you felt you needed postpartum to open up the intuitive parent, which is great.

Jeanelle 46:40
Yeah, absolutely. It became so clear to me that women who free birth, women who home birth, and even some women who birth in the hospital fall through the cracks. Like, you know, there’s just it’s either because of it’s a funding thing or it’s because we just don’t have the right systems in place to make sure that women are supported postpartum to establish their parenting journey. When I started my private practice, I was like, Wow, I need to provide this support for women who who are falling through the cracks because I fell through the cracks and I still attended my provider appointments, you know, bizarre.

Kiona 47:17
I think it would be hard, for people to not feel like they haven’t fallen through the cracks. Because for me as a birth worker. The way that people, especially in hospital settings, care for their patients. It’s so generalized

Jeanelle 47:33
Oh.

Kiona 47:33
because everybody fits under this big umbrella. You know, all of these tests and things, they’re absolutely necessary in some But in the times that they’re not necessary, and then you’re like, okay, you passed this, you fit in this box, you don’t pass this, you fit in that box. And then another test determines which left or right they take next. And it’s just like checking off the boxes versus like sitting, hearing and listening to the person that is like, I’m feeling this in my body. I don’t worry, you’re fine. A lot of people feel that.

Jeanelle 48:01
Yeah.

Kiona 48:02
So I’ve never spoken to someone who hasn’t felt like they’ve fallen through the cracks

Jeanelle 48:08
Mm hmm.

Kiona 48:08
in

Jeanelle 48:08
Mm

Kiona 48:08
some

Jeanelle 48:09
hmm.

Kiona 48:09
way.

Jeanelle 48:09
Yeah, absolutely. When you’re in the public system here, at least in Australia, is even if you do get the help that you want, there’s often a waiting time, a waiting And so by the time that you’ve got such a especially when it comes to breastfeeding, as one example, when it comes such a time sensitive thing, if you’re on a waitlist, it doesn’t really help. Even if you didn’t fall through the cracks. So yeah, so that’s why I saw my private practice. And so that’s why I decided like, look. Breastfeeding is awesome, is very hard, but it’s a skill that we need to learn. It’s, you know, I fell through the cracks. I couldn’t get the help that I wanted. and thank goodness for the research. I was able to do and the information I was able to find and prepare myself for breastfeeding and what is correct And I didn’t know before I went into this research that there’s a right way to hold a baby. I mean, like, to be fair, when I breastfeed my second bone, now it’s just whatever works, but.

Kiona 48:58
All right.

Jeanelle 48:59
When you’re learning how to breastfeed the first time. If you’ve never done it, then it’s a big mindset shift of how to latch a baby and how to actually check Are they latching properly? What isn’t is a normal and yeah, it’s just interesting. And I also focus on other areas like this shouldn’t surprise you. But now that I, went down the free birth path, of course I went down the elimination communication path. if you’ve never heard of it. It’s essentially potty training from birth, but it’s less formal in that you’re just fostering the baby’s innate ability to communicate their toileting needs, just like the way that they communicate their feeding needs and their sleep needs and things like that. So I help parents with that. And also further on to that is non-coercive. Potty training is such a normal thing for us to go to the toilet. We everyone has to go to the toilet. So why are we attaching an outside incentive? needs to be in an internal thing, like I want to keep myself clean so I go to the toilet. So the reason why I bring that up is I don’t I don’t like the whole I don’t I not only don’t like I don’t think that it helps to have things like potty training charts and things like that. It’s an external motivator. The kid will only be going to the toilet because it’s going to make you happy, not because it’s good for their health. just decided that, you know what? We need a holistic approach. We need some holistic approaches try early parenthood. things like establishing sleep routines and I think we briefly talked about this before sign to record is sleep training. It’s a major thing that that we use in our modern society to create, quote unquote independence where as in what I call intact cultures, so cultures where they might be considered less developed, they’re attached to their children and the children are attached to their parents for years. And that in my mind, in the research that I’ve read, is that is the thing that fosters independence, healthy independence. so I help parents establish sleep and kind of sleep habits. And if you want to, if you’re the type of family that wants to co-sleep, okay, as a registered nurse, I do have to kind of do the disclaimer of the just what the official recommendations are But let’s see how we can support you doing what you want to do safely. Like I co-sleep with my kids and I wouldn’t do it any other way. I sleep, train my first for months and then it was incredibly stressful for everyone involved. Stressful, like science knows, has proven that a baby’s cry unanswered causes stress hormones in the in the mum’s body. Why would you put yourself through that on purpose? It’s torture. Like just yesterday in the car, on the on the freeway. And my baby was crying. She was so hungry and I was like, my husband’s like, you need to you need to pull over right now. I’m I’m like, this is putting me in major stress mode, man. You.

Kiona 51:50
Speaking of your second one.

Jeanelle 51:52
Yeah.

Kiona 51:53
We should talk about their conception. And is it a boy girl?

Jeanelle 51:57
As a little girl. Yeah. So she was a surprise. So I knew too much with my first. I always say I do too much because I had so many I wanted to do everything by the book. I had all the tests. So this time I was like, No,

we’re not doing that again.

Kiona 52:15
Hmm.

Jeanelle 52:16
So she was an oopsie, a happy oopsie, and that we wanted to start trying in March early this year for our second I told my husband, I really want to try. Naturally, I just want to try because, I mean, when I with my first pregnancy, the miscarriage that I had that was natural. But then obviously at the time when we started trying for my first, I was a bit like unsure about the whole process because I had had that miscarriage and because I had been told that I can’t fall pregnant naturally or I’m unlikely to fall pregnant naturally. So we never really tried. We just weren’t careful, if that makes sense. I was still breastfeeding my first and I starting to and I was following. I am I am now again. But I was following the fertility awareness method where I told my husband like, Look, there’s a small chance I might be ovulating as my cycles come back. But also, you know, it’s all over the place because I am still breastfeeding. I was starting to track like my temperature and cervical mucus and things like that. So it was like a trifecta of things that we were looking at. Is how much, how much of my breastfeeding, what is my temperature and what is the the discharge going? And I was like, Look, there’s this mortaza might be Now, I didn’t mention this, or my husband works away two weeks at a time, and then he comes back for a week. He works in the mine site and he’s like, Oh, I’ve been away for two weeks, you know, like took five. And of course I fell pregnant. And it was quite funny finding out that I was pregnant with her just the day before I tested, I was having a conversation with one of my really close girlfriends and she she said because I was like, Oh, like, I think I might be having some pregnancy symptoms just like, Don’t you do it? my hens party is coming up, because we both fell pregnant within six months of each other with the first go. And she’s like, Don’t do it. Like we know we haven’t had a night together where we could have some wine and have some fun. I was like, Yep, yep, I agree. Like, it would be nice. And she’s like, Don’t, don’t be pregnant. Please.

So the next morning I did the test and of course I was very pregnant. It was it came up very, very quickly positive. So I messaged her and I was like, You’ll never guess what I just did. And she’s like, No way. So anyway, obviously she wasn’t actually angry, but it was just kind of a bit of a funny the fact that we talked about it just like before, the way I told my husband was he so he was dropped off by one of his from the airport and we met gaming, so we were a bit nutty in that sense. I was playing some games and just unwinding for the night and I was like, Oh, I’m just going to finish this game. And then I’ll come join you and we can debrief or whatever for the week. When I found out I was pregnant, I was like, like I need to keep this test so I can show him when he comes home. but then I also had friend who was helping me clean the house and my mum come over that So I was like, okay, I’ll just quickly like hide it in my vanity. A message is me, a photo, and he’s like, Do you have COVID? Joking, but he was like, Do you have COVID? And I ignored it because I was like, Oh, like I wanted to see his reaction.

Anyway. So I go into the room and he’s like, Would you get my tackles? Like, No.

And he’s like, You should check your phone. I was like, Nah, I did get the text. And no, I don’t have code. But he’s like, Yeah, I know.

But he thought that it was all planned because I had in my rush to hide my pregnancy I had hid it in his it not in my So when he when he went to shave his beard, of course he found that pregnancy test. But yeah, so anyway, he was like, Oh, I thought you were saying that you were playing your game. So I thought I would play a game and send you that kind of advice.

Kiona 55:59
And here is how Jackson felt when he found out about both pregnancies.

Jeanelle 56:49
Anyway. So, you know, we were like, okay, we’re happy, we’re excited. But she quite literally going to be coming six months earlier than we would have liked, which meant two under two. Yeah, it was it was a very similar pregnancy in many ways in like symptoms wise, except I kept saying like I felt like my symptoms started earlier. They were yet much earlier. And I was like, I’m very lucky in that I don’t have major like I don’t actually get sick in the first trimester. I just I’m extremely sensitive to Oh, very gag with my second. I was so sensitive that even the air con smell and the gust of air from an air con would put me off into like a gagging. But then again, very, very fortunate that I don’t actually get sick, so to speak. And then, you know, I have an old back injury from when my nursing that flares up with all my pregnancies from the look of it. And again, all of that just started earlier this time around. But because I had my experience with the system and I declined many of the tests. So I again still wanted because I knew I would free birth this time I was like, why would I why would I go back to the system? I still wanted a record of my pregnancy and I still wanted to see a midwife. I so wanted to get the belly measurements and the blood tests for me and stuff like that, just to make sure that I’m okay, especially iron wise and normal. So I saw a community midwife who she doesn’t attend births, just monitors your pregnancy and then checks in with you postpartum. And that’s pretty much it. And she was like, Are you going to do the GD test? I was like

I was like, You know what? I’ll just assume that I’ve got it and I’ll make sure that I’m exercising, make sure that I’m eating okay. But I’m not going to stress over it I’m not going to lie. There were a couple of moments throughout the pregnancy where I was like, well, like maybe I should test like, what if baby is, like, really just big bellied and they will get stark and stuff like that. And I was like, You know what? No, my body will do what it needs to do. And we know the risks We know the things to look out for and that’ll be okay. I originally didn’t want any scans, however, at about 12 weeks I got some spotting and I thought, Oh no, I’m, might be miscarrying again. And so I did go to the hospital and they scanned and saw that baby was definitely not 12 weeks. Baby was like six, maybe max eight weeks. And so I was like, Oh no, you know what’s happening? Because I could still detect heartbeat and stuff. I went for a proper dating scan few weeks later and they were like, okay, we’ll just change the dates. You know, your dates are slightly off by slightly, I mean five weeks. So I ended up actually being seven weeks when I had that spotting. So they put it down to implantation bleeding. So, you know, that was one of those things. And I was like, okay, fair enough. I did go in because they were like, Oh, it might be a missed miscarriage type thing where don’t have an actual miscarriage where you’re bleeding, but baby’s not viable, like maybe he’s passed away or but and then it your body just retains. So you might need intervention. Whereas luckily that wasn’t the case for me. So I was very, very grateful. And then again, I was I could write like that. No more scans. And then when I was like, Oh, I would like just for us to do the 20 week scan, make sure everything’s finalised. And I agreed to that and everything was fine. So it was just, such a different experience where I don’t regret those scans, but it was just so different where I didn’t have to get to these appointments every four weeks. I wasn’t every four weeks that your blood sugars are slightly high or you know your baby is big or any of that. And I just felt so much calmer in this I mean, as a running after a toddler, of course, it’s a lot busier, but it was lots less stressful a pregnancy overall. I didn’t know that this was normal until I started talking to second time mums was I felt a lot more disconnected to baby because I felt guilty that I couldn’t spend so much headspace on connecting with Baby. Like, Oh baby, how are you? Like I could, you know, when I wanted a nap with the first, I could go down for a nap. I could be like, Hey, baby, how you doing in there? you know, it was just it was just so different, such a different experience the midwife that I had she is so beautiful in that she kept offering the test. She’s like, would you like this test? This is why we recommend this test. And I could say yes or no. And it was just I was I had so much more say. I felt in the process, I was so much more involved in the decision making process of what tests I should and would take. Some I declined and some I that. And the difference that it made, it was huge to my and also just to my satisfaction, I guess, for the care that I was receiving. And obviously I was planning my free birth the whole way. And refresh my memory of like, why do I want to do what I want to do when. Had. This was my first, but I definitely, obviously is much fresher, more more fresh in my mind is the fears of what if something goes wrong. And again, this is such a normal experience that women think that, you know, something must be wrong because they’re having this thought is I can believe and think that it’s just our bodies and our minds preparing each other for what is to That it is a life changing experience. And this is this cocktail of hormones that’s going on. It’s just so cool. And I just reminded myself, like, look, this is why I do what I do. I feel safest to labour in my own space and to be surrounded by people that I, love and that I know care for me and I know what to do if, if something should go wrong. We have a plan in place and just it was just kind of that reaffirmation over and over again of like, we’re okay. We don’t need rescuing.

Kiona 1:02:24
Right.

Jeanelle 1:02:25
So with with baby number two, I Braxton Hicks from like 28 weeks and I was like, Oh my goodness, The thought of Braxton Hicks gave me Braxton Hicks.

was in there, I was like, man, like, I’m never going to go into labor because this is just this is insane. And oh, by the way, I should just say my I don’t know if I mentioned that my first came exactly on his due date, 40 and zero, which is just cool. Like, he knew my body knew exactly when he needed to come by. Anyway, so with this one, I had like, really regular niggles is what I call them. I call it my niggles. Friday because it was on a Friday morning that I was having these niggles and I was like, Hmm, these are a little bit more intense than the ones that I have been having. I was about 37 and a bit weeks, so I was term technically, but I was, I was a bit early, but I was like, Alright, I’m in labour, let’s go everybody. It was the Friday before my husband had to fly out for work. So we were like, okay, he’s either going to fly out and not be here for the birth or this is not labour. And because what kept happening because it would get intense and then it would fizzle out, it would get intense and then would fizzle out. And I was Nah, no way. Like, oh, like I don’t want my husband to miss this. I don’t want to be here alone with my toddler like it was this whole it was actually a stressful day. And my house was like, Well, are you going into labour? And I was like, I don’t know. I feel like given the chance it good and I didn’t go into labour. It fizzled out and at that point we were like, okay, so it’s too late for you to fly out now. So he actually postponed his flower day to the next Tuesday and went, Okay, if nothing happens over the weekend, he will fly out and nothing happened over the weekend. So we get to Tuesday and I was like, look, the thought of you not being here, that that stresses me out a little bit. Like I do want that support. And so we decided that he would start his leave then. So he started his leave two weeks earlier than we had originally planned, but it was the best decision that we made because we had two weeks of just being able to spend so much time with the firstborn with each other and just it was just a really good, like transition from family of three to family of four because we were wanting spend as much time the postpartum. Because with our first my husband had to go back to work within two weeks. So we only had two weeks postpartum, whereas this time I was like, Oh, I want the full six week experience. And we’re like, okay, it’s okay. Like we’ll just sacrifice a little bit of time before baby’s here. So he here for for the birth and the but it was like a high risk, high reward, as he goes and she doesn’t come before he’s flown back and he gets to spend the whole period of time away. Oh, it’s a low risk, lower But in that we might lose a couple of weeks, so we end up quote unquote so it wasn’t really losing because I think it was well spent. But we lost essentially about ten days because I then went into established Labour, a proper on I think I was 59 and three or four. We like 2 a.m. and four. I am in the morning that day I kind of woke up to again my Friday, Friday and he goes Labour because like what happened after that point, It was a major mindset shift leading up until that point of my Friday and he goes, I was okay to be pregnant for 43 weeks. I was like, I could do this forever. Like, it’s okay. The thought of my baby coming, put my body into baby needs to be in now. I was like, It needs to happen now. I was impatient those last two weeks. I was like, You can’t just threaten to come and not come. Like, what are you doing to me?

I was like, okay, actually this might this might be it. But also, I don’t know. So we went down to the markets and caught up with some friends and were a couple contractions was like. Like one day, if this is a contraction, all of this is a hiccup. I don’t know. Again, because I thought of Braxton Hicks. Guy was giving me Braxton Hicks. Like, seriously, I’d be walking in and suddenly I would actually have to stop and breathe through it. And then obviously it would be nothing for like the next few hours. So and that was like early in pregnancy. unfortunately, that day we also had a wake to go to. And so I was like, Right, I’m going to go down for a nap while the toddler is napping. And we’ll see how I go afterwards. If this is actually the real deal or not, because I hadn’t lost my plot, my guest blog, I hadn’t had regular contractions or anything like that, I was just like these just feel again, a little bit more intense and and the previous weeks leading up to it, and I woke up from my nap a half an hour later, I told my husband, Look, I don’t think I slept. I think I might by being in labor. He was like, okay, that’s okay. You know, we’ll see what happens when the toddler wakes up. We’ll decide whether you’re going to go to the wake with us or if we’ll just go without. And it’s picked up off of that. So within the next half an hour, I lost my mucus plug. I then started having more regular contractions and I was like, actually, I need to stop moving through these contractions. This is labor. So we decided I would stay home. Then two would go to the wake and I would let them know if anything happens, if we need any help or if I need any help or whatever. Otherwise they would go for half an hour and then come back and that would be the end of it. So at 2:15, I had already stripped down. And, you know, same as with the first. So I was like, I lost my pants and I lost my shirt. And next minute I was like, I want to get in the shower. And I knew I need to get into the shower. And I knew I was close to transition. When I felt nauseous, I and this was 2:15 and I messaged Mrs. Bosworth and said, need to come home. I think baby is going to come soon. So he obviously just got to the wake like quite literally. I think he got there like 15 minutes prior and was starting to greet everyone and mourning our loved one and then having to kind of pick up and come home to to some intensity. So I got into the shower after I texted him and lost track of time where I was just I was in there like a wild animal. I kid you I remember kind of like pacing around in there going, I’m thirsty, like I want water. And I was like, talking to myself, like I want, I want. And I just couldn’t get it out of my mind. And I was just like, left and right. Left or right. All right, there’s water here. And I’m like, Oh, like, just open mouth under the shower, just drinking this water. Seriously, It was wild. It was feral a little bit. I was like, and then I started having these anger and frustration towards my husband. Like the whole point of him staying is not going to work well. So he’s here with me and I was like, Oh, I think I’m in transition. And then I had this fear of, Oh my goodness, I’m going to have this baby alone. Like, oh no, like I’m going to be, you know? And I was like, You’re still in transition. Jeanelle. And it was really, really cool to have that kind of perspective of I’m having these thoughts and these emotions, these these ebbs and flows of whatever was happening. But then at the same time, I was able to kind of briefly step back from them and kind of go like, this is where we’re at. Like we’re progressing, you know, we’re fine. My husband gets home and he he’s like, you know, how are you going? And I was like, Yeah, good. I’m going to start pushing soon. And I meant the next contraction and he thought within the next hour or two. So my man goes and he’s like, Right, I’m going to get the birth pool ready. And I remember kind of yelling out after him like, I’m not moving. He didn’t hear me. So the toddler stays with me in the bathroom, which was totally fine. He was just kind of watching, like Mommy’s having his shout. He’s making some noises. We had been preparing him with a book, a beautiful book, a free breath book of like labor. And so it’s got like, this is a placenta. Mama’s going to make these noises. This is what the baby looks like. He is the umbilical cord. Like it was really, really cool book. And so he was like, Oh, Mama’s making noises. And I had my first one call that my push and contraction. And this was one thing that I wanted to do differently from my labor, from my first to my second I felt that I was too impatient with the pushing stage with the first. So with this one, it was really my goal that if I had that capacity to remind myself not to just go straight into pushing as soon as I have a pushing sensation and just kind of trying my best to breathe through it and just kind of let my body push. I really wanted that because I really felt that if I had if I had just a little bit of patience towards the end, there, I might not have him. And like I said before, tearing wasn’t necessarily a bad thing. It’s just. my intuition was, I think if I was just a little bit more patient. Who knows? So anyway, so that was one thing that I wanted to do differently, was to allow my body to do the pushing, the most of the pushing again. My what has hadn’t broken the arrow burst yet. So when I felt that pushing sensation, I was like, Oh, like that is quite, quite a big pressure in my perineum. So I kind of reached out and I could feel the waters bulging. And then between contractions, the waters would go back up again. Just normal, you know, in and out, in and out. But after that, so that was the first one. The second one, same thing, waters bulging. And at that point, the water was annoying me. So I turned the water off. And my toddler thinks Mommy’s not having a shower. And he opens the shower door, which lets in a very cold gush of air. And I said, Close door. The poor toddler obviously is completely shook by the fact that I just yelled at him and he is running out of the bathroom, which then is intercepted by my husband who comes running in, having been struggling in the background trying to get the hose attached into the bath pool and trying to get all that sorted, had only filled up about five centimetres or whatever comes in running. And as he comes in running and like the toddler is like you know, shattering said contraction. She comes out. So he hadn’t drowned yet. So she she comes back in, waters burst, I feel her turn and she just comes flying out. So it was just three things happening all at once where husbands running in the door. A toddler is like, What the hell? And baby has just gone right. I am just going to be flying out like Superman and And I remember just feeling of I felt her turn and I was like, Oh my goodness, like, she must have crowned. But then I reached down again. There was just water there turns and then comes flying out. And it was just like, like this. All these things happening at once. And baby was here. And I hadn’t known that she was a girl until she was born. look at her and I’m like, I can see you’re trying to breathe. Why can’t you breathe? And I realised, Oh, there’s a thing called an umbilical cord and quickly unwrapped that and, and then she took a breath and she was just, you know, again, sharing her voice with the world. And husband is is calming the toddler and kind of coming to terms with, you know, there’s a baby here and postpartum. He was like, I was there for 15 minutes before baby was born. So he came home with 15 minutes to spare. And yeah, like within again, 20 minutes of baby being born, placenta came and it was just so fast. And so her labour was three and a half hours from established labour until baby was born three and a half hours. And so it was very, very quick.

Kiona 1:13:21
Now here is the point of view of the births from Jackson.

Jeanelle 1:13:53
It was really, really cool in that we were alone in many ways. Like I could just kind of go through the laboring motions and I was a proper a proper free bath in that there was actually no one there. that was the second one. I was just I’m still processing it because it was so fast.

Kiona 1:14:12
And you’re only eight weeks postpartum.

Jeanelle 1:14:14
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Man And how quickly that has gone, I cannot begin to tell you.

Kiona 1:14:20
How are you doing now? How are you feeling? Postpartum. How’s your body feeling? How’s the toddler handling being a big sibling?

Jeanelle 1:14:28
Yeah. So didn’t care. So that was one thing. And I just put it down to the fact that I was able to breathe through those early positive contract contractions, even though I only had three. But then also today, day one or two postpartum. I, I told them I was like, I feel great. Like, I don’t want to get out of bed, but I feel great. And I just felt so nurtured because we really did a lot of preparation for the postpartum because I said I really wanted to be looked after because the first time I felt the need to get up and do the things. And I in many ways I had to within two weeks because my husband had to go back to work. And so this time I was like, I really want to feel looked after and pampered and I want to just have sort of pressure to have to hand my baby over to anyone if if, you know, just because they want to hold them. I just want our bubble for as long as I can. we did our very best to foster that. So my husband was in charge of organizing visits, so we only did one visit a day. He would always be like like ushering them out the door. You know, It’s like you’ve ever say now, especially of my my family, you know, bless them, they they’re beautiful, but can be a bit up close and personal sometimes and overstay their welcome. So the couple of times like you know, I think we’re going to go have a nap now and you know so it was really good in that way. We were much better prepared this time around where we had a mule train set up this time. And I really wanted to make sure I was having those warm, nurturing foods and really follow it to the tee, but kind of brought elements of the Asiatic kind of approach to to postpartum nutrition principles. And it was just it’s been an interesting transition because I felt during pregnancy I felt a little bit disconnected from baby. And then immediately postpartum also felt disconnected from baby. I was kind of like, oh, like, am I going into the depression side of things? Like I was just overanalyzing it. Like, I definitely didn’t have that very big emotional response to baby number two being born. I was like, Oh, maybe it’s because my label went really quick. Or maybe it was because I didn’t feel connected during pregnancy, but I just realized it was because I your attention is divided and that’s normal. Few weeks later, I was like, I don’t think that I would be feeling as connected to Baby that I do now if I didn’t have those first few weeks of really protected time. And I think that is so important for myself and I guess for for future if there should be any future babies, is you do need that time to connect with baby because it’s a reality is your attention is divided and it’s it’s not because you love baby any less. It’s just because already have a relationship with your firstborn and forget what it’s like to. I mean, I forgot what it’s like to have to build this whole new relationship. It’s like meeting a whole new person. You don’t just know them because you carried them. And I mean, some women have the privilege of having that, but not everyone does. And it’s okay. So. So yeah. So I think the postpartum period was very, very vital that support wise, preparation wise, bonding wise, the toddler, he’s got his moments some days. He is so loving towards her and he’s like, I want to touch her and I want to cuddle her. I want to hold her. And then the next minute he’ll just go throwing hands.

And I think it’s a little bit of sometimes I think it’s a bit of cuteness, aggression. Sometimes I think it’s a bit of jealousy. But I keep being told by moms who’ve more than the that is normal. It’s okay for that to It does So I’m holding out for that at the moment. But otherwise I think we’re going okay.

Kiona 1:18:09
Good, good. Jeanelle, it is so awesome to hear your stories and like, you know, talking about the entirety of your pregnancy and birth with your son and then touching on your business and what inspired you to create the intuitive parent and then being able to go and dive into the birth of your daughter? I think that’s so awesome. I’m so thankful that you were open to sharing your stories. And I only have three final closing questions for you.

Jeanelle 1:18:38
Yeah, please.

Kiona 1:18:40
Okay. So my first question is, what is one piece of advice that you would give to all pregnant people to prepare for labor, birth and postpartum?

Jeanelle 1:18:52
Who

can I start my stories again?

No, I kid. Look, I think that one thing that I said earlier, and I want to say that again, is making decisions out of fear is dangerous. Whether you are in a hospital setting or private setting or afraid to sitting, making decisions out of fear is dangerous. So whenever you’re making a decision, make sure that you’re doing it from a point of I have educated I have sought opinions and I mean plural. And that you’re doing it from a place of empowerment and feeling peace about your decision. If you feel like something’s off, you need to listen to your intuition. I called my business the intuitive parent because I believe and is not necessarily always 100% on the money, but there’s always some merit to it and you always do need to kind of go, Hmm, let’s ask more questions. Let’s investigate a bit further. So that’s definitely my number one is, is listen to that intuition and make a decisions from a point of empowerment, not out of fear.

Kiona 1:19:57
I love that. I think that’s incredibly important because it is incredibly true. Making your own decision based off of what you’ve learned yourself versus what other people are shoving down your throat or into your ears. So.

Jeanelle 1:20:09
Absolutely.

Kiona 1:20:10
And here’s Jackson’s advice for partners.

So my next question is what is one resource that I can share with my listeners on your behalf?

Jeanelle 1:20:35
So do have for locals. I stopped setting up a playgroup where we are sharing. Basically, just from an evidence point of view, we’re having some great conversations with mums and their journey in early postpartum or prenatal or early parenthood essentially, but then also creating a site, a space for the kids to play. But I guess for those who aren’t local, I help with all things early parenthood and we just have some really great conversations And where are you at right now and how can I help? And if I can’t help, then that’s fine. I offer a free, 15 minute calls where if you’ve got like one question, like a rapid fire question, then I’m happy to help you answer that or we just have a bit of a chat and brief a troubleshoot and see what are the next steps that you need to take to achieve what you want to achieve, whether that is returning to work whilst breastfeeding or establishing breastfeeding or learning how to breastfeed or even we know when you starting to look at starting solids is, you know, doing your anaphylaxis and choking and and CPR training. I do offer those virtually, which is pretty cool, just to be able to empower mums and dads and parents in general of this is what you need to do should something happen. And again, when you get to the major milestones of potty training and wanting to learn more about AC, you know, I love talking about all things early parenthood, so even just having a chat, I have a really cool Facebook group called The Intuitive so you’re welcome to join that as well. But yeah, otherwise I really just take this as a very, very casual but vital approach to to early parenthood, really.

Kiona 1:22:02
Love it. I love it. There’s so that can be unpacked in what you offer as resources. There’s a lot of pathways that you can go through in order to get that support. So I think that’s really great.

Jeanelle 1:22:14
Oh, I should mention that the website is w w w the intuitive parent account that I you.

Kiona 1:22:20
And I’ll make sure that that link is in the show notes for this episode as well.

Jeanelle 1:22:24
Fantastic.

Kiona 1:22:25
Now, my final question for you is, if you could describe each of your births with one word, what would it be?

Jeanelle 1:22:34
Oh, man. I should have thought about this before. The first one I would say freeing is freeing in very many ways. And the second, I would say, was powerful. Definitely. And I don’t know if you want me to explain why, but. Yes.

Kiona 1:22:56
It’s. Do I feel like we have a good idea as to why you would put both of those words to your stories? You’re hearing them. I think that they fit incredibly well. Not that it’s my position to say whether or not they.

Jeanelle 1:23:09
You.

Kiona 1:23:10
I can see I can absolutely see why you would choose those words. And here are the words that Jackson chose.

Jackson 1:23:17
First one. I mean, think about this one for a while. It’s a hard one. Going to go a bit cliche, I say magical. It was yeah, it was a whole experience just watching it. And I’ll go through all those stages of labour and then meeting Michael. And then the second one, I’m going to have to go quick. It was, it was quick. Very fast. Yeah, it was. It was cool.

Kiona 1:23:45
Now it’s time to wrap up this interview. Janelle, thank you so much for sharing your stories with me. I’m so excited to just have my listeners hear this because, one, you’re in Australia, a lot of my listeners are in the U.S. so hearing what it’s like to birth in a different country is amazing. And also birth happens everywhere. So I love hearing from you. So thank you.

Jeanelle 1:24:08
Absolutely. Oh, thank you so much for having me. It’s been awesome. I love I mean, we talked about this just before is. us both loving, talking about birth. We could be here for hours, and it’s just such an honor to be able to do that. It’s it’s it’s so cool. And being like, exactly like you said, being able to do it from across the other side of the world. It’s it’s exactly it’s so cool.

Kiona 1:24:27
Yeah. Thank you for waking up so incredibly early, because right now for me as i’m recording this, it is. 3:52 p.m.. But i think it’s like almost 7 a.m. your time.

Jeanelle 1:24:38
Yeah, it’s about eight, 8 minutes to 7 a.m.,

Kiona 1:24:42
Yeah.

Jeanelle 1:24:43
so. 652.

Kiona 1:24:44
Yeah. And so you were up really, really early. So thank you so much for that. Thank you for that sacrifice.

Jeanelle 1:24:50
Thank you. Absolutely. Let’s do it again.

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